603: Too Smart to Move
05 Sep 2024Exit interviews for the outgoing iPhones and Apple Watches, and what we hope to see from their successors next week.
Episode Description:
- Join us in raising money for St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital
- Follow-up:
- Mac mini redesign updates from Mark Gurman
- Minimum Mac RAM (via Brian)
- JPEG XL support (via Kelly Thompson)
- FTC’s noncompete ban was blocked 👎🏻
- World vs. App Store
- iPhone 15 exit interview
- Apple Watch Series 9 & Ultra 2 exit interview
- Ask ATP:
- How hard is it to maintain server compatibility for old Overcast clients? (via PG&E Delenda Est)
- Does following a podcast in Overcast “help the show” in Apple Podcasts or other ways? (via Marc Robinson)
- Post-show Neutral: Marco’s Rivian service
- Members-only ATP Overtime: AI Angst
Sponsored by:
- Squarespace: Save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code ATP.
Become a member for ATP Overtime, ad-free episodes, member specials, and our early-release, unedited “bootleg” feed!
Chapters
- Donate to St. Jude 🖼️
- Mac Mini rumor update
- A previous Mac RAM upgrade
- Screen capture without the badge
- JPEG XL compatibility
- FTC vs. non-competes
- Apple vs. the world
- Sponsor: Squarespace
- iPhone 15 Pro exit interview
- #askatp: Old Overcast APIs
- #askatp: Does following “help the show”?
- Ending theme
- Neutral: Rivian woes 🖼️
Donate to St. Jude
⏹️ ▶️ Marco John is hacking up a lung, over.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, John is very unwell, and I didn’t find this out, or we didn’t find this out until, I don’t know,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey two minutes ago? So if this episode is only 15 minutes long, it’s because
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’re taking pity on our good friend. And if it’s hugely long, then it’s like every time I feel unwell.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So we’ll see what happens. It is September, which means
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s Childhood Cancer Awareness Month. I feel like I didn’t pronounce any of that with all the letters and the words, but here we go. We’re
⏹️ ▶️ Casey doing it live. So I’m going to vamp while I pull up the official ad read and tell you that,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey hey, there are a lot of children that are unwell and that’s not okay. And a lot
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of them have some flavor of cancer and that is also not okay. And so
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we are part of Relay and we’re also partnering with Relay. We’re partnering with ourselves. I don’t know. You just go
⏹️ ▶️ Casey with it. So we, Relay, have raised over $3 million
⏹️ ▶️ Casey over the last five years, starting in 2019. It’s bananas. It’s absolutely bananas.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And because of that, Relay is going to have their name put on like this, it’s more than a plaque,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but put on like this board in the St. Jude campus for all the corporate and personal
⏹️ ▶️ Casey donators that have done, just gone above and beyond. And that’s super incredibly cool. And so
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what we are doing is we’re trying to raise money for St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital. St. Jude does incredible,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey phenomenal work. And they do it in such a way that it affects people all over the world. So St. Jude
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is headquartered in Memphis, Tennessee. I will be there in a couple of weeks when Relay does their 12-hour
⏹️ ▶️ Casey podcast-a-thon. You can watch me melt into a puddle over the course of those 12 hours
⏹️ ▶️ Casey as I do everything I can to raise more money for these six children. But here’s the thing, St. Jude has treated
⏹️ ▶️ Casey children from all 50 states and around the world. 90% of the children at risk
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of developing cancer live in low and middle-income countries. That is unacceptable to St. Jude, and you know what,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s unacceptable to us. So that’s why St. Jude launched St. Jude Global. That way
⏹️ ▶️ Casey every child with cancer, no matter where they live, and also other catastrophic diseases, by
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the way, they have access to quality care and treatment. So when I was at St. Jude in April
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for the Play Live Summit, they brought several different people on stage, and some of them were
⏹️ ▶️ Casey survivors in St. Jude patients, some of them were family members. And the number of stories
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that we saw, but actually not just on stage, but just in general with the people we met, The number of stories
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we saw where it was something along the lines of, I am in some foreign country.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I have done everything that my country knows how to do with regard to either my cancer
⏹️ ▶️ Casey or my child’s cancer or my brother’s cancer. And we were at wit’s end. I mean, we were basically
⏹️ ▶️ Casey given a death sentence and then somebody thought, you know, let’s call St. Jude, let’s see what happens. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the number of stories that, you know, there’s all these different ways. These stories started that somehow or another involved
⏹️ ▶️ Casey really dire circumstances, but every single one of them ended with, we called St. Jude
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and within hours, within hours, we had plane tickets to go to Memphis,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Tennessee, and they didn’t have to pay for it at all because St. Jude pays for it all.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So in order for St. Jude to pay for all these things, we ask for you to donate whatever
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you can. And actually live on air in just a minute, we will have my favorite and least favorite moment of the year
⏹️ ▶️ Casey when I somehow ruin my donation and it becomes a joke for the next year. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we’re gonna do that in a minute, but hey, there’s one other reason you might want to donate or one other excuse Perhaps to donate
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one other just a justification for donating and I like to call it the Marco offset Marco
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Can you tell me what the offset is, please?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yes, starting probably next week many of you out there are going to be buying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco new Apple products You might have even bought some other things recently possibly the new Android
⏹️ ▶️ Marco folding things Maybe I saw there was a new remarkable tablet today that looks really cool all sorts of fun
⏹️ ▶️ Marco gadgets launching in this gadget season And you probably don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco necessarily need to spend money on new gadgets. Maybe you got something broken that needs to be replaced, but for the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco most part, we all know that this is like, these are mostly luxuries that we have, because we’re
⏹️ ▶️ Marco very fortunate to be able to afford nice electronics from any of us listening to this podcast.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Now, when you buy your nice electronics that you don’t really maybe need, but you’re buying because you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco want a treat, and they’re fun and they’re awesome, you tend to purchase other things at the same time. things
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like a case or additional storage upgrades or a keyboard
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or some other kind of accessory for the thing that you’re buying. You even do things like you know AppleCare,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know warranty services, or you certainly almost you know almost always in most places you have to pay sales tax.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So you have all these kind of add-on fees and upgrades and accessories and taxes to the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco thing you are buying. I suggest when thinking about what your minimum donation to St. Jude should be,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco add up all those extras that you tack on to your purchase or purchases, including all
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the taxes, all the storage upgrades, all the accessories and cases and warranties and all that stuff. Add
⏹️ ▶️ Marco up all that. That should be your target minimum donation to St. Jude if you can swing it. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco fortunately for us and for most of you out there, many of you out there are able to swing it and that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco great. And this is how you can assuage some of your guilt about these new tech products that you’re buying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco by giving a nice chunk of money if you can to St. Jude.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, so here’s the thing. When we rally for a common cause, we become more than a community. We
⏹️ ▶️ Casey become beacons of hope for all. Yes, that is a little bit silly, but it’s true. It’s really true.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So please join Relay, an ATP, and donate to St. Jude this September for Childhood Cancer
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Awareness Month. You can go to stjude.org slash ATP to just go straight to the donation
⏹️ ▶️ Casey area, which is what we’re about to do, the three of us. Or if you want more information, or if you perhaps want to start your own campaign
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you can go to stjude.org.atp to just go straight to the donation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So now the three of us are going to do our annual donations
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and here’s the thing we always say we’re going to do the gentlemanly thing of agreeing on exactly how
⏹️ ▶️ Casey much we’re going to donate and I believe as with past years we had agreed on $7,000 but we could never
⏹️ ▶️ Casey do that because we’re all just difficult. So the question is,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey who is going to be the winner by donating the most, but also sticking to the gentlemanly
⏹️ ▶️ Casey agreement of $7,000? So in past years, I should have looked this up, in past years I think I’ve done $7,001 or $7,001.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I feel like that isn’t enough, but I want to stick close to the $7,000.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so I am going to, as we speak, I’m going to say
⏹️ ▶️ Casey payment details. I’m going to see if I can Apple Pay this. And I’m not going to tell you quite yet exactly what I am
⏹️ ▶️ Casey going to do. I have to add an address. My mistake. You’re going to have to wait while I do that. But my
⏹️ ▶️ Casey thinking is that I need to do just a little bit more.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m hoping that’s not a bad choice. And I probably shouldn’t be telling you this while
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m on air because now Marco is probably just tripling his donation, which honestly I’m
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with. I’ve already hit my button. I hit it while you were talking already. So it’s I’m in.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Oh, all right. But I’m not going to, I promise I’m not going
⏹️ ▶️ Marco haven’t looked yet.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, I’m hitting the Apple Pay button right now. Done. I donated $7,001.43, because 143
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is short for I love you, one letter, four letters, three letters.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And that’s for Aaron. And so if
⏹️ ▶️ Casey lost, it’s really you being mean to Aaron is what’s going on. So let’s
⏹️ ▶️ John did. You definitely talk too much this year, Casey. Also, you’re incredibly bad at this game. I basically
⏹️ ▶️ John I basically conceded this game because like like like
⏹️ ▶️ John what’s his name? Adrian Veidt or whatever I made my donation 35 minutes ago Because I thought we
⏹️ ▶️ John were doing it before we started airing so you could have just looked and seen the amount that I did But apparently
⏹️ ▶️ John Marco has just decided he’s sick of losing this game
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Marco is decided enough is enough. I
⏹️ ▶️ John right? So, I mean I fair fair enough like this year I was trying to give honestly I was trying to give Casey a chance to win this year, but
⏹️ ▶️ John apparently Casey cannot be helped.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Wait, why? Where did 17 come from? I did 11 last
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John Oh my God. So
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so so the final donations from ATP, me and Aaron coming in last at $7,001
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and 43 cents. Then John Syracuse at $7,017 even.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then Marco in TIF swooping in to take the lead comfortably take
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the lead. I I should add. Marco, how much did you two donate?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco 7,777.77. Well done. I
⏹️ ▶️ John do feel like Marco is, again, it’s a technical foul on massively exceeding the amount, but because it’s for
⏹️ ▶️ John a charitable cause, and because he had never won before, we’re going to let it slide this time. But we can’t
⏹️ ▶️ John support this kind of inflation.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this is awfully large inflation. I mean, this is ridiculous. It shall not stand, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we can’t get upset.
⏹️ ▶️ John Anyway, so collectively, ATP has donated, according to my little calculator here,
⏹️ ▶️ John twenty one thousand seven hundred ninety six dollars and 20 cents. Of course, that exact amount is what we would do. But
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s what we ended up at. By the way, I have to say that we’re I mean, this is obviously it’s a relay pledge
⏹️ ▶️ John drive and we have relay podcasts and we are really adjacent. We are friends with them. But I’ve always been proud of how
⏹️ ▶️ John much of the relay pledge drive is from listeners to a non relay podcast.
⏹️ ▶️ John ATP listeners donate tons of money. Like we already talked about the like the leaderboard thing we have for Casey stickers
⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever, where the, you know, ATP listeners with large means put huge donations in for
⏹️ ▶️ John the chance of getting those stickers, right? Sometimes people put ATP in their comments or whatever. We’ve been amazed by how
⏹️ ▶️ John much money and how generous ATP listeners on are for this pledge drive. So that makes us proud of our listeners.
⏹️ ▶️ John And I think we’re really helping out the the pledge drive for St. Jude.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, yeah, I couldn’t agree more. And it is really kind of you to listen to us make this pledge. I know this
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is taking a long time, but honestly, sorry, not sorry, because it’s worth it. So, thank you so much,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we really appreciate you. And again, I will reiterate, just because we donated $7,000 and change,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey some of us almost $8,000, even though we did that, you can donate $7.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’s fine. We’re still happy about that. Don’t let us lead you any other way. We’re still very happy about that.
⏹️ ▶️ John please— —Like, the majority of the money is not the people donating thousands of dollars. It’s small donations.
⏹️ ▶️ John Give $10, give $20, give $5, anything you can. Yep,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so please, stjude.org, S-T-J-U-D-E dot org slash A-T-P. Thank you.
Mac Mini rumor update
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Let’s do some follow-up. A Mac Mini redesign updates from Mark Gurman. So Mark
⏹️ ▶️ Casey had announced some expected Mac Mini redesign or redesign changes
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and whatnot, and then has gone back to the well and has clarified a bit. So Mark writes, the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey M4 Pro version of the Mac Mini will have five USB-C ports, three on the back, two on
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the front, like the Mac Studio. That model will also retain an ethernet port, good, HDMI
⏹️ ▶️ Casey port, good, and headphone jack, sure. but prepare to say goodbye to the USB-A ports found on the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m happy with this. Like to me, like the retention of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco most of the things on it, I’m happy with that. And USB-A, like it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco been very helpful to have USB-A ports on lots of things long into the USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ Marco transition. I do think it’s now time that we can drop them on most things.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I agree. I agree wholeheartedly. Now we’re gonna get everyone writing to us about how wrong we are, Here, you know, you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey can’t win them all. Then Mark continues, I’ve also been told that the computer’s power supply will be internal. This was a big
⏹️ ▶️ Casey deal because they’re saying, you know, the new Mac mini is going to be roughly Apple
⏹️ ▶️ Casey TV sized. And although the Apple TV does indeed have its power supply internal, which
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is to say you just plug in a cord, there’s no brick involved, but you know, that’s kind of a computer,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but not really a whole computer. And so people were justifiably a little worried that perhaps
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this wouldn’t be the case with the Mac mini. maybe it would go more like the current iMacs which have the brick on the outside. But
⏹️ ▶️ Casey no, apparently the power supply will be internal, which I am very happy about.
⏹️ ▶️ John Do you know if the Logitech, like the little RF dongle things for their wireless mice because Bluetooth sucks,
⏹️ ▶️ John if they’re USB-C now?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey As far as I know, they’re not. Now I do take a little bit of offense at you saying Bluetooth sucks. Maybe I’m a Bluetooth unicorn, but I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey really don’t see the issue with using Bluetooth peripherals.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s so much worse than the little RF dongles in pretty much all possible ways.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey except you don’t have to have a dongle, which is great.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, honestly, that is very, like I’ve in various gaming laptops
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and stuff, I do use other mice besides Apple’s Magic Mouse and other people in my family,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco we have mice all over the house. I have so far not found a compelling case
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for the custom RF dongles. To me, there’s a compelling case for wired mice, especially
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on a gaming PC situation or just a PC situation in general, there’s a compelling case for wired mice and there’s a compelling
⏹️ ▶️ Marco case for Bluetooth mice. and the other options I just have not found to be worth
⏹️ ▶️ Marco their hassles. Like I know they’re lower latency and different, like I know there are technical
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s not even that, that’s all true. Like the advantages for it, and they actually have like Gaming Mice that are wireless now with some
⏹️ ▶️ John super wireless protocol, whatever. It’s mostly the fact that the Bluetooth range and reliability
⏹️ ▶️ John is often at the limit for desktop computers, even for a laptop if you keep it far away, of working well.
⏹️ ▶️ John Like, I mean, my computer is, my tower computer, I can touch it with my hand. It’s not that far away. But
⏹️ ▶️ John no Bluetooth mouse can reliably communicate with this computer. It’s not that
⏹️ ▶️ John far away. RF dongle, I could be in the other room, smooth as glass. Right? And that’s the
⏹️ ▶️ John advantage. It’s just so much better range and reliability at the cost of filling one of your ports with a little thing.
⏹️ ▶️ John And the reason I ask about the little dongles is because, yeah, this is the Mac mini. You know, if you’re gonna
⏹️ ▶️ John get rid of a big port, get rid of it on the computer that has mini in the name. It’s supposed to be small. They’re making it smaller. I get it. It’s fine.
⏹️ ▶️ John Drop it. But the alternative is to have, you know, a dongle,
⏹️ ▶️ John like a little, the stupid white dongle, or, you know, some other thing hanging off the back of it that you then attach your little
⏹️ ▶️ John RF dingus to if you have a mouse like that. And that’s more cumbersome than having a bigger computer with
⏹️ ▶️ John no dongle in some situations. So there is a balance here. Obviously we should just be blaming Logitech and say,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey why are you still shipping USB-A dongles?
⏹️ ▶️ John Make a USB-C one. Like it’s obvious, the thing, the actual thing that’s in there is so tiny, I’m sure it
⏹️ ▶️ John could fit, but anyway. That’s the only downside I can see. It’s like, why would you still have USB-A ports
⏹️ ▶️ John and you’ve got like those UB key things and like DRM stuff for expensive applications
⏹️ ▶️ John and RF adapters for mice.
A previous Mac RAM upgrade
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, yeah. All right. So with regard to minimum amounts of Mac RAM, which we
⏹️ ▶️ Casey were talking about in the context of going to, what is it? 12 gigabytes of RAM in future
⏹️ ▶️ Casey 16. I’m sorry. Thank
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John you. Brian writes,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I was at Apple’s 1996 worldwide developer conference where Gil Emilio, I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey got that right this time. See, it’s Gif, not Jif. Anyway, made the announcement during the keynote that all future Mac models
⏹️ ▶️ Casey would ship with a minimum of 12 megabytes of RAM up from eight. As I remember, that announcement
⏹️ ▶️ Casey got a standing ovation from the developers in attendance. And then apparently,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey after ruminating, and this is years later, I think, after ruminating about my recollections of the WWDC keynote, I am no longer
⏹️ ▶️ Casey confident in my description of the response as a standing ovation. Oh, this was, I think, Brian had written us
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a little while later. Anyways, instead, the enthusiasm of the applause was more along the lines of,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey we were expecting the next RAM jump would be to 16 megs, not 12, but hey, we’ll take it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey RAM, kids. We did a lot with a little back then.
Screen capture without the badge
⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, Cigar Jha writes with regard to the screen recording badge
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on outgoing video. Excluding the screen recording badge from outgoing video is actually possible, but it
⏹️ ▶️ Casey requires the full access screen capture API rather than the window selection one. The way it works is that the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey screen recording badge is an extra child window added by the system that you can mask out while streaming.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I didn’t know that. The additional API is required since the window picker lets the system handle the selection, then it hands you the frames.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And this includes the recording badge by default. Removing it requires assembling the window list yourself, which is quote unquote,
⏹️ ▶️ John So as usual, to provide a better experience to your users, you need to use the API that Apple doesn’t want you to use.
JPEG XL compatibility
⏹️ ▶️ Casey With regard to JPEG XL, Kelly Thompson, this is the alleged new codec
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that Apple’s gonna be, well, it’s not that new, but Apple’s going to be embracing it, which is new. Kelly Thompson
⏹️ ▶️ Casey writes, support for reading JPEG XL images has been available on Apple platforms since last year.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey They work in Safari preview photos and all the apps like Pages and Keynote. Here’s the kicker though. You have all that beautiful
⏹️ ▶️ Casey dynamic range, but preview and Safari don’t support HDR images of any type quite yet. Safari supports
⏹️ ▶️ Casey HDR video, but not stills. Obviously, HDR images work great in photos. It’s a weird state of half in,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey half out. JPEG XL has been jointly developed by Cloudinary, which I’d never heard of, and Google.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey For ages, JPEG XL support was behind a flag in Chrome. Everyone was just waiting for them to turn it on.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Then they released a chart saying, AVIF handily beats JXL and removes support.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And we’ll put a link to the chart in the show notes. The entire web responded, saying, in fact, the chart showed the exact
⏹️ ▶️ Casey opposite. And everything above quality 55, which is where the vast majority of images
⏹️ ▶️ Casey saved are, JPEG XL handily beat AVIF at every point.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey In fact, JPEG XL isn’t optimized at those low quality levels because it’s not really usable. The Google
⏹️ ▶️ Casey team that works on JPEG XL is in Europe and the team that works on Chrome is in California. Well, either
⏹️ ▶️ Casey way from the Chromium bug tracker request, reopen JPEG XL issue. We’ll put a link to that in
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the show notes. You may already be receiving images, excuse me, in this format without even realizing it. major
⏹️ ▶️ Casey cloud delivery services already offer JPEG XL as an option for two browsers that support it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey One cool feature of the default JPEG XL encoders, CJXL is that you can get
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to select an effort level from one to 10. If time isn’t a critical factor, the encoder can spend more time
⏹️ ▶️ Casey optimizing file size. If not, you can compress them as fast as JPEG at the expense of some size. Here’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a beta version of a tool we developed for the upcoming JPEG XL website that shows the relationship between
⏹️ ▶️ Casey distance, effort, quality, and encoding speed.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s kind of like if you have like ImageOptim and those other sort of PNG Crush and all those utilities that say like, use
⏹️ ▶️ John more computation time to make the image a little bit smaller, that’s like built into this format. So you have an adjustable how much
⏹️ ▶️ John effort you wanna put in to getting the smallest size possible, which is just,
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s really just a honeypot for web developers because every web developer will say, I will spend 24
⏹️ ▶️ John hours making this image smaller because it’s gonna be served a whole jillion times in the 30 seconds
⏹️ ▶️ John after I post it, you know what I mean? So every little bit that we can crush this image. And that
⏹️ ▶️ John was the same thing with CDNs, vending JPEG XL versions based on the browsers
⏹️ ▶️ John that they know support them or whatever. So yeah, JPEG XL could be out there and you could be receiving it, but yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John the support in macOS, I’m hoping if Apple does announce, hey, these new iPhones have this new
⏹️ ▶️ John image format, if that even happens at all, I hope support comes to the rest of their platforms.
⏹️ ▶️ John Like things like preview and even Safari not being able to show HDR
⏹️ ▶️ John still images in any format, let alone JPEG XL, seems like a limitation that they should overcome and this would be the perfect
⏹️ ▶️ John time to do it. So again, I’m rooting for this rumor. This is still just a rumor that Apple’s doing this, but regardless of the
⏹️ ▶️ John rumor, Apple has been adding JPEG XL support slowly and steadily to their platforms.
⏹️ ▶️ John It’s just not fully baked yet. And they certainly haven’t announced that they’re switching the iPhone camera to use
⏹️ ▶️ John it As the rumor says, they will.
FTC vs. non-competes
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Moving along, we need to talk about the FTC’s non-compete agreements
⏹️ ▶️ Casey ban, which if you recall, the FTC, Federal Trade Commission, said here in America, hey, you can’t have non-competes
⏹️ ▶️ Casey anymore. That’s not fair. To which a federal judge said, hold my beer. Reading from The Verge,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a federal judge has blocked the Federal Trade Commission’s ban on non-compete agreements that make it difficult for workers to join their employers’ rivals
⏹️ ▶️ Casey or launch competing businesses. The ruling prevents the FTC’s ban on non-compete agreements from taking effect
⏹️ ▶️ Casey on September which is today, though the agency could still appeal the decision.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey On August 20th, U.S. District Judge Ada Brown in Dallas, Texas, ruled that the antitrust agency exceeded
⏹️ ▶️ Casey its statutory authority to ban practices related to unfair methods of competition, saying the non-compete agreement’s ban
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is quote, unreasonably overbroad without a reasonable explanation, quote, and would quote,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey cause irreparable harm, quote. To whom, Judge Brown? To whom? Brown’s decision now stops
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the FTC from blocking non-competes nationwide after initially delaying the ban with a preliminary
⏹️ ▶️ Casey injunction in July. The ruling upholds a lawsuit that tax firm Ryan LLC
⏹️ ▶️ Casey filed in April to challenge the non-compete agreements ban, arguing that it would make it difficult for companies to retain talent.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Here’s an idea. Work harder to retain the frigging talent.
⏹️ ▶️ John I love that. It would make us harder to retain talent if we couldn’t legally handcuff our employees
⏹️ ▶️ John by telling them they can’t get a job at the same industry for some arbitrary amount of time. Get out of here with that nonsense. I
⏹️ ▶️ John love, it’s just, the things that are quoted here, like it’s a, it’s a, uh, unreasonably overbroad without
⏹️ ▶️ John a reasonable explanation. I’m pretty sure the people on the other side of this case gave a reasonable
⏹️ ▶️ John explanation for why non-competes are bad. Now, maybe they mean a reasonable explanation of why this particular agency has the
⏹️ ▶️ John ability to do this or whatever. It’s, it’s frustrating. Uh, you know, we would hope
⏹️ ▶️ John that collectively we can find a, find a way that will survive judicial challenge
⏹️ ▶️ John to get rid of this horrible thing that is non-competes. that is non-competes. The state of California did
⏹️ ▶️ John it somehow. The U.S. government still working on that. So fingers crossed.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It’s so gross. I dislike it so very much. Moving along though.
Apple vs. the world
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Apparently more governments would also like in on pooping on the App Store because
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Spain has launched an investigation to Apple’s App Store. This was in July. Reading from MacRumors,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the National Commission of Markets and Competition, the CNMC, this week announced a probe
⏹️ ▶️ Casey into the App Store, citing concerns that the company might be imposing unfair trading conditions on developers who distribute
⏹️ ▶️ Casey their applications to the platform. The investigation was initiated ex officio, reflecting the significant
⏹️ ▶️ Casey economic influence of App Stores in Spain. Apple’s practices could constitute an abuse of a dominant position,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey which is prohibited under Spanish competition laws and the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union, TFEU.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Additionally, India has an antitrust probe which finds Apple has abused its position
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the apps market. Reading from Reuters, an investigation by India’s antitrust body has found that Apple exploited its dominant
⏹️ ▶️ Casey position in the market for app stores on its iOS operating system, engaging in, quote, abusive conduct and practices,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey quote. a confidential report seen by Reuters showed. The Competition
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Commission of India, or CCI, has been investigating Apple since 2021 for possibly abusing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey its dominant position in the apps market by forcing developers to use its proprietary in-app purchase system.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And then going for the trifecta, the UK has entered the chat. Reading from 9to5Mac, a UK antitrust
⏹️ ▶️ Casey investigation into Apple is officially closed, despite finding the company to be at fault after the regulator missed
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a legal deadline. Whoopsie-dipsies. However, a case seems almost certain to be reopened under an upcoming law, which will
⏹️ ▶️ Casey grant new powers to the competition and markets authority or CMA.
⏹️ ▶️ John What if all these governments are like cheating off each other or like the language in these stories from three entirely
⏹️ ▶️ John different outlets is so similar and the language of all of their complaints is so similar that it’s like.
⏹️ ▶️ John These places smell blood in the water and they’re like, well, this is a thing now. Uh, everyone’s, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ John trying to, uh, tamp down the app store, citing the same type of things, like a competition dominant, abusing dominant
⏹️ ▶️ John position, yada, yada. So everyone’s getting in on the act. Now how will these all turn out? Who knows? But
⏹️ ▶️ John the problems for Apple are just getting started. As we said they would, when this started years and years ago, we’re
⏹️ ▶️ John like, when one country does this, more are going to follow. It’s not going to be like, oh, you’re going to satisfy the Japan
⏹️ ▶️ John Trade Commission, and that’ll be it. You’ll never hear about this again. Nope.
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iPhone 15 Pro exit interview
⏹️ ▶️ Casey So, it is time for everyone’s favorite tradition, which was a genuinely excellent
⏹️ ▶️ Casey idea that Marco came up with a few years back. This is the iPhone 15 exit interview.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Marco, would you like to introduce this?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, started doing this a few years ago, as Casey said. This is basically on the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco eve of the iPhone’s replacement, the episode before they’re going to have their event and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco launch the new one. I like to send the old one out with an exit interview of how was
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the outgoing phone this year now that we’ve had a whole year of usage. It kind of helps
⏹️ ▶️ Marco inform other shows, more often do direct predictions or wish lists
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of what we want for the next phone that will be announced presumably next week.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think having it framed as an exit interview of the previous phone helps
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to inform what matters and what kind of progress we’re actually hoping
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to have and in what areas. So we’re going to start with the iPhone 15 Pro.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And now to be clear, John, you didn’t have the 15 Pro, right? This wasn’t your year? Yeah, but my wife did.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I’ve experienced the phone. Right. And Casey, you had the big one for the first time and I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco have the medium-sized one, which I guess is the small technically, but there’s only
⏹️ ▶️ Marco two sizes and neither of them are small.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey did get a 15 Pro, not a Pro Max. So I’ve used it some,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey obviously not as much as she in the same way that John has used Tina’s some, but you are the only one of the three
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of us that has actually used it full time.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So iPhone 15 Pro, I would say the number one thing that I absolutely
⏹️ ▶️ Marco love about this phone, USB-C. We were waiting for it for so long.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco They finally gave it to us in the 15 And this is not a small deal.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco This has been a big deal. This has been so nice. So, not only do I have
⏹️ ▶️ Marco easier charging everywhere that I am, like, because all over my house, my
⏹️ ▶️ Marco backpack, my traveling, now we just have one kind of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco cable. And it charges everything. It’s amazing. There
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are no more lightning cables in my travel bag at all. and around the house, there
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are hardly any lightning cables necessary for almost anything. The only thing we use lightning for is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco charging Apple TV remotes, which we almost never have to do. Like, that’s literally like, you know, maybe twice a year we have to charge an Apple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey TV remote. Well, the modern
⏹️ ▶️ Casey ones, the modern ones are USB-C. The older ones were-
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco Yes, I just
⏹️ ▶️ Marco never upgraded to that one. So no more lightning cables for almost anything except for, yeah, Apple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco TV charging for the remote. Also on my desk, I have to have one to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco power up older iPhones that I use as test phones, and also to charge Magic Mice
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and Magic Trackpads. That’s it. Like, oh, and I guess a couple of my older AirPods cases.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But even like my travel AirPods Pros are now the USB-C model there, which is an upgrade I strongly recommend.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Oh, I really wanna do it, but I’m too cheap.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It feels so wasteful, but like for, but I had to get a second pair because one of the old ones finally died,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and it, so I got the new one. Oh man, it’s so nice. But anyway, yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco having all USB-C, total game changer. I’ve even found that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there’s a lot of kind of like little things you can now do that you couldn’t do as easily or at all
⏹️ ▶️ Marco before because it supports USB-C. So for instance, I can plug
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in my big Fuji camera with a regular USB-C cable, even just a quote
⏹️ ▶️ Marco charging cable that only uses like slow USB-2 speeds. I can connect that directly from the camera
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to my phone and import photos. It’s glorious. Like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so much little stuff like that just works. Some audio equipment works that way too. Like I have found it is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco just USB-C has been an awesome upgrade on the iPhone. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you are still holding on to an older phone and you’re wondering like, should I upgrade this year or whatever?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco USB-C alone is a great reason to upgrade. But you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s obviously how much that’s worth to you depends on the pricing. but wow is it nice.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco That is so much nicer. Like I knew it would be nice to just like, you know, get rid of some cables.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I had no idea how nice it would be. So I am extremely, even like, you know, simple stuff. Like, you know, you have like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a USB, you know, battery pack that you’re using to charge up something. And you want, oh, can I top off my phone
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for a minute? Yeah, sure. Just pop out whatever you’re charging and plug it into the phone. And then you unplug the phone and plug in
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a laptop or an AirPods case or whatever, all with the same cable, all connected to the same battery without having to like mess with things.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Oh, it’s so nice. It is so good. So yeah, USB-C A+.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, just to jump in really quickly, like Marco said, I knew this was gonna be an improvement for
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sure. I didn’t realize how vast an improvement it was going to be.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It is so empowering, is a bit dramatic, I think, but I can’t think of a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey better word for it at the moment. It’s so empowering to look at any of my devices, asterisk,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and any cable I have nearby and say, Yep, that’ll work. And maybe it won’t be as quick as I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey want to be that data or power, but one way or another, anything can charge anything.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Just the other day on one of the final pool days we had before our little community pool had closed,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a friend of ours came and she has an iPhone 15 pro, I guess as well. Yeah. Cause it’s USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ Casey anyways, she has an iPhone 15 pro and it was near death because she had forgotten to charge it the night before
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and I didn’t have a charger with me, but I had my fully charged iPad with me and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I had a USB-C cable in the car and I said, hold on, I know what I’ll do. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I went and I grabbed my USB-C to C cable from the car, plugged iPhone into her iPhone and sure
⏹️ ▶️ Casey enough, she slurped her phone, slurped up some of the charge from my iPad, which was totally fine. Having
⏹️ ▶️ Casey anything being able to charge anything again, asterisk, et cetera, et cetera, is so great. And to your
⏹️ ▶️ Casey point, Marco, not having to carry 44 different cables is so nice. It’s just, it’s so
⏹️ ▶️ Casey wonderful to not have to care if the thing I need to be charged is the computer, is the iPad,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is the phone, it doesn’t matter. All of them charge the same way.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. And the only downside I would say is that the USB-C hole in the phone does
⏹️ ▶️ Marco get like lint from your pocket in there in a way that is harder to remove
⏹️ ▶️ Marco than with lightning. With lightning, you could put pretty much anything up there and just just kind of scrape it out and it would just kind of fall out.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco USB-C, I did have an issue earlier in the year where I had to like, where I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Marco my port was breaking. So I just couldn’t get cables to sit right or charge reliably. And it was just crap
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in the port, and I thought it wasn’t because I had just done like some basic, you know, clean out with like one of those plastic
⏹️ ▶️ Marco tools thinking like, maybe this will do it. And it took like a little bit deeper of a clean to get all that stuff out.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And it was just stuff in the port. It was just, you know, harder to get out than lightning. But other than that, it’s been
⏹️ ▶️ Marco only benefit. And I also like, I thought, and we’ve been talking for years before
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they did this, I really thought that the public perception of the USB-C change
⏹️ ▶️ Marco would be as harsh as it was when they switched from the dock connector to lightning.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, that’s true. I thought the exact
⏹️ ▶️ Marco same. Like regular people out there hated the switch to lightning from the dock connector because they were
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, Apple is just doing this as a cash grab to sell new cables and new bricks, whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And this time I thought we would have same problem and we just didn’t. I think that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco largely because USB-C is not proprietary to Apple. And so when
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they made this change, there was already a massive marketplace of USB-C cables
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and chargers made by everybody. And so it was not as much of like, oh,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they’re trying to sell their own cable. I’d be surprised if Apple sells many of their own cables.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think most people just get whatever they can on Amazon and it’s fine.
⏹️ ▶️ John I’m pretty sure if you go back and listen to old episodes of ATP, all those reasons you decided were actually cited back when we were discussing
⏹️ ▶️ John this. So I don’t I don’t think either one of you or any of us actually thought it would be as bad and then because
⏹️ ▶️ John we listed those reasons and lo and behold it wasn’t. Although that said, I think it has been even quieter
⏹️ ▶️ John than we thought it would be because when we were discussing it we’re like, okay, well, is this going to be as bad? Here are these mitigating factors that can
⏹️ ▶️ John make it not as bad. But not only was it not as bad as lightning to USB or lightning to 30
⏹️ ▶️ John pin to lightning, I think it was just pretty much a non issue. I mean, maybe it’s more
⏹️ ▶️ John of an issue outside our circles. Maybe most people don’t have a USB-C phone. Maybe it’s lagging, but right now,
⏹️ ▶️ John on the eve of the iPhone 16, I think it has exceeded expectations
⏹️ ▶️ John into how much better the transition was. Even though I think we all said it was going to be better. We didn’t think it was gonna be this much better.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I certainly did not think it was gonna be, as you said, like this quiet, like no one. See, I heard
⏹️ ▶️ Marco no complaints from literally anybody that they changed the port.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John Like, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I mean, you’re right that like, you know, not everybody is on that fast of an upgrade cycle, but still, I literally heard
⏹️ ▶️ Marco zero problems about this. Oh,
⏹️ ▶️ John speaking of the port, on the flip side, my wife’s iPhone 15 Pro is the only USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ John phone in the house and so we have the opposite problem here where it’s not like we’ve gone to this whole USB-C lifestyle.
⏹️ ▶️ John We have those like communal chargers everywhere with lightning stuff and we had to add the
⏹️ ▶️ John right number of USB-C things there. Now, arguably we should have been adding them before because we’ve got USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ John iPads, we just happen to have other places to charge our iPads, but now every place where there’s a bunch of lightning cables, there’s now at
⏹️ ▶️ John least one USB-C cable in the mix. Eventually we’ll fully transition, but
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s gonna be a while because my wife uses, I believe four, maybe three,
⏹️ ▶️ John she carries four iPhones. She uses three of them for Pokemon Go, one of them is her work
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco phone. So it’s just like
⏹️ ▶️ John a brick. Can you imagine how much like four pro phones weigh? And it’s just so heavy. Anyway,
⏹️ ▶️ John it’s gonna be a while before all four of those phones are on USB-C. So I have a long road ahead of me with a
⏹️ ▶️ John combination of Lightning and USB-C on all our communal chargers.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And you know, and while we’re on USB-C here, I just wanted to give a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco shout out to USB-C power delivery. As a spec and as a product
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ecosystem, USB-C PD has, and for the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco less nerdy people out there, that is the spec that allows USB-C to deliver much
⏹️ ▶️ Marco higher power amounts than old USB could ever deliver. That’s how you can get USB
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to power an entire laptop by itself, for instance. The move in general
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for so many tech products, and even products that are kind of just barely tech products, the move to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco being powered by USB-C and USB-C PD wattages has made
⏹️ ▶️ Marco overall life so much, just like a little bit nicer in a lot of ways. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like the inverse of paper cuts. Like, you know, we complain about little paper cuts on little annoyances in products.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco This is like, you know, whatever the opposite of a paper cut would be. A paper circle,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know. I can’t think of a good word that’s funny. But it is just little delights, I guess that’s the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco word. All the time. Little delights where there are,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and you don’t necessarily realize it. Once you’ve moved to the USB-C world, you don’t realize how good you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco have it until you have to go use something older that has its own power brick or
⏹️ ▶️ Marco its own older USB micro or whatever port. And the world
⏹️ ▶️ Marco we have now is Sony, is all of that stuff about like, wow, I can charge all my phone and my
⏹️ ▶️ Marco iPad and my laptop from all the same thing. That’s true. And that shows in lots
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of bigger ways now too. Like so many other gadgets or things
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are now powered by USB because it’s just kind of cheaper and widely available and so many
⏹️ ▶️ Marco devices. I even have a power drill that is powered by USB-C now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco own built-in, which is, and I mean, look, I’m not a contractor, but for my purposes, it’s totally fine.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like, there are so many things like that now that are entering my life gradually over the last few years that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco just, oh, this new XYZ thing, this is now USB-C powered. Like, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it could be so many things, like toothbrushes, vacuum cleaners, so many things are now being USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ Marco powered. And the more stuff that you get like that in your life, the more those little
⏹️ ▶️ Marco conveniences and delights you run into sometimes. Oh, this, I need to get a new power adapter
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for my drill. Do I have to buy the proprietary thing from the drill company?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, it’s just USB-C. I wanna have a shorter or longer cable for this gadget.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Do I have to buy a special thing or see if anybody makes a weird one on Amazon? No, you can just use USB-C.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like there are so many little tiny things like that that add up in your life over time the more
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you’re into the USB-C lifestyle. So thank God for the Europeans for forcing this
⏹️ ▶️ Marco upon Apple. And thank God for the ecosystem for being here and for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco pretty gradually, but now with quite some speed behind it, converting over to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this wonderful lifestyle. It is wonderful. I love USBC. For the data side of it, yeah, it’s a
⏹️ ▶️ Marco mess. The power side of it is awesome.
⏹️ ▶️ John Let me give the EU partial credit because I think we said before, I think Apple would have switched with or without the EU. It’s just a question
⏹️ ▶️ John of the individual timing. They might have even done it at exactly the same time because they did do it earlier than required. But
⏹️ ▶️ John yeah, Apple’s lack of investment in lightning and the lack of expansion in the capabilities of that
⏹️ ▶️ John board made it inevitable that it would eventually go to USBC. So they have.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I think, you know, one of their stated goals, one of the EU stated goals was
⏹️ ▶️ Marco reducing e-waste. And I think largely this does that. Like the move of so
⏹️ ▶️ Marco many things to USBC power, I think really does reduce e-waste. Because think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of, again, go through your tech closets and see how many things there are that have their own
⏹️ ▶️ Marco custom power bricks and stuff that now the modern versions of those don’t because they can be USB-C
⏹️ ▶️ Marco powered. I think they make a pretty big impact here. So I, again, so happy
⏹️ ▶️ Marco about this change. All right, let’s move on to the other headlining feature of the iPhone 15
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Pro, the action button. It’s funny, it got out there, there was a little
⏹️ ▶️ Marco bit of drama here and there with cases, And then we pretty much never heard about it for the rest of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the year, but I gotta say, I find the action button so useful that I instantly took it for granted.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like the idea now of using a phone without the action button would be a significant paper
⏹️ ▶️ Marco cut to me. It would be like a significant step down because I use mine, I have it set up for the flashlight, and I know there’s lots of other ideas
⏹️ ▶️ Marco people have for it, but I need a flashlight fairly frequently, and I use it at least
⏹️ ▶️ Marco twice a day. And I just, I love having that hardware button there. It is fantastic.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I use mine for camera, and I know that many would call that a kind
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of a novice or noob approach because there are many other ways to get to your camera, most
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of which are fairly quick. But I don’t want to have to think about it or have to worry about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey swiping in just the right way that it actually listens to me and swipes the way I want it to go
⏹️ ▶️ Casey from the lock screen. And so for me, For me, I love having the camera as my action
⏹️ ▶️ Casey button action, and I use that at least daily. I don’t personally
⏹️ ▶️ Casey think I would use the flashlight quite as much, but hey, that doesn’t mean you’re wrong at all. If
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it works for you, that’s all that matters. I don’t know that I would be
⏹️ ▶️ Casey lost or anything without having the action button, you know, in like a
⏹️ ▶️ Casey future phone if for some reason it went away, but I definitely would miss having it for sure. And maybe
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one day I’ll use it for something more advanced. But yeah, I think the action button also gets a thumbs up from me for
⏹️ ▶️ John I think the camera is a perfectly good thing to use it for. My success rate at doing the swipe gesture for the camera is
⏹️ ▶️ John up using the, what you would think would be the even slower one where you have to hold your finger on the little camera
⏹️ ▶️ John icon. It’s like, there’s a delay. You’re like, why are you using the one with the delay? That’s gotta be slower. No, because when I try
⏹️ ▶️ John to swipe and it fails and I try to swipe and it fails, it’s always like, oh, got to get the camera out quick, you know, because something cute is happening or whatever,
⏹️ ▶️ John right? That is the time when I am completely unable to get the camera up. So the action button is going
⏹️ ▶️ John to be great. But I have to say that when I need to get my camera out real fast, it’s almost always
⏹️ ▶️ John my phone and not my wife’s phone. So I actually haven’t built the habit of using the action button,
⏹️ ▶️ John even though hers is set to camera, because I’m never grabbing her phone real quick to take a picture
⏹️ ▶️ John because going over to where she is or getting her phone is going to kill the time that would be required anyway. So I’m looking forward
⏹️ ▶️ John to my iPhone 16 with the action button so that I can build that habit because I can almost guarantee
⏹️ ▶️ John that pressing that side button is going to have a much higher success rate than me trying to swipe
⏹️ ▶️ John or me having to hold my finger down on that little thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yep, very much so.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then finally, the only other thing I’ll say about the iPhone 15 Pro is that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the thermals really have been pretty bad. It really, you know, we all saw right at the beginning,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco we’re like, this phone seems to run hot, really hot. It does, it does
⏹️ ▶️ Marco run very hot and it does thermal throttle itself a lot in use, especially
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like in the sun in a car. That’s why I had to like buy a chiller phone mount that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco uses, you know, a thermoelectric element just to cool the phone down in the car just so I could keep
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the display on and take any power whatsoever. Like this phone runs hot and it has run
⏹️ ▶️ Marco hot since day one and Apple tried to, I think they successfully mitigated the bad
⏹️ ▶️ Marco press that could have resulted from that when people started reporting that right at the beginning and they should have solved it they said
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it was a software issue and they should have software update it wasn’t a software issue it was a hardware
⏹️ ▶️ Marco flaw this phone overheats much more easily than previous phones did and the rumors are that the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco upcoming 16 pros that should be announced next week apparently have a modified and better
⏹️ ▶️ Marco thermal design and that’s so that is if when I look at my 16 pro wish list
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It’s actually really short. It’s, I want better thermals and I could use the 5X camera that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Casey has, which it does seem like both of those things have been pretty solidly rumored the entire time for
⏹️ ▶️ John I have to say though, how many years? I think it’s been like three or four years that there have been rumors of better
⏹️ ▶️ John cooling on iPhones. Vapor chambers, graphite sheets, not just this year, not just for the iPhone 70,
⏹️ ▶️ John but last year and the year before that and the year before that and we have never gotten them. So I really, really hope this
⏹️ ▶️ John is the year because those rumors are always there And the reason they’re there is every year, like
⏹️ ▶️ John again, if you have a phone out in the sun, they will overheat, right? Or if when you first update your phone
⏹️ ▶️ John and it’s doing all the indexing, they get hot. People don’t like that. And so they’re always like, boy, could there be better
⏹️ ▶️ John cooling? And then you look at what Apple has done with cooling and we know they could do more because Android phones are like, what more
⏹️ ▶️ John can we do? Can we do more than just having, you know, a heat sink up against the thing and so on and so forth? And yes, you can.
⏹️ ▶️ John Lots of other phone makers have done things. And so whenever we see the rumors, Apple’s gonna do it. They’re gonna put those graphite sheets in there.
⏹️ ▶️ John They’re gonna use more thermal paste. They’re gonna use a vapor chamber every year. We’re just disappointed.
⏹️ ▶️ John And obviously the 15 Pro had the, what the heck is the chip? The A18 Pro? I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t even remember the numbers anymore. Yeah, the one on the new three-millimeter process. Right, so
⏹️ ▶️ John it was a really, they were pushing the limits with that chip on that process
⏹️ ▶️ John that Apple’s already moving away from. I kind of see why it had thermal issues. And I
⏹️ ▶️ John also kind of see why this would have been a good phone to try out those graphite sheets, you know what I mean?
⏹️ ▶️ John But no, it didn’t happen. So I really hope it does come on the 16th. But if we go another year
⏹️ ▶️ John and everyone says, oh, those rumors were for the 17th, not the 16th, I am going to be disappointed. Despite the
⏹️ ▶️ John fact that in general, I haven’t noticed my wife’s phone getting particularly hot, except for when she’s playing Pokemon Go, in which case that
⏹️ ▶️ John makes all of her phones hot. But as long as it gets the job done, as long as it
⏹️ ▶️ John doesn’t stop working, which is your problem when you have it in the car, like it literally stops being able to be used for the thing you’re trying to use it for
⏹️ ▶️ John because the screen gets so dim, you can’t see it anymore. I don’t know if the 15 Pro was
⏹️ ▶️ John over any kind of limit to bother people more than some past phones, but it’s time for Apple
⏹️ ▶️ John to invest a little bit more in cooling on their top-end phones.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey You know, it’s funny you bring all this up because I do agree that throttling is an issue and that the thermals
⏹️ ▶️ Casey are not stellar, but I would actually say to my estimation, this was a mild improvement
⏹️ ▶️ Casey over past years. And you know, when I’m using my phone at the aforementioned pool, I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey think it was the 14 Pro, maybe it was the 13 Pro, but I wanna say it was the 14 Pro. That bad boy
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was so dark, I could barely read it pretty much
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Whereas this one, it definitely gets dim and noticeably so, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I feel like not only would it recover quicker, but it didn’t get as dim
⏹️ ▶️ Casey as either the 13 or the 14. So while I don’t disagree that we do, I think we do need improvements and I hope
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for improvements, I actually thought that this was a slight
⏹️ ▶️ Casey improvement over years past, although not a great one.
⏹️ ▶️ John I think you’re just experiencing screen improvements there and not necessarily thermal improvements, right? Very
⏹️ ▶️ John well could be. Just the screen is brighter and takes less power at a given level of brightness. So
⏹️ ▶️ John now the dim one is not as dim and you’re attributing that to better cooling or better thermals, but I think it’s just
⏹️ ▶️ John screen improvements that you’re benefiting from there. But anyway.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey It doesn’t feel like that’s the case, but you very well could be right.
⏹️ ▶️ John Either way, the experience isn’t as bad as it has been. That’s the thing though, it’s very situational. Like if you buy a car
⏹️ ▶️ John with a big glass roof and all of a sudden your phone is overheating because on the dashboard it’s getting more direct sunlight, you’re going to say, oh, it’s the
⏹️ ▶️ John phone’s fault, but maybe it’s because you got a new car, right? Like all of these phones have always been very vulnerable
⏹️ ▶️ John to being in direct sunlight for any amount of time. And it’s just a question of, do you start putting your phone
⏹️ ▶️ John in more direct sunlight? If so, you will perceive that phone as being worse thermally. But
⏹️ ▶️ John I mean, there’s 15 Pros I have heard people say and gets a little bit warmer than they expected. And like a lot of
⏹️ ▶️ John these things, especially with the SoC, the heat is very localized and it’s when the SoC is doing a lot of work,
⏹️ ▶️ John right? The thing that gets hot is that little SoC in there. And so on iPhone setup
⏹️ ▶️ John day, when it’s redoing all your indexes and doing all that stuff, yeah, it’s gonna get real hot and people are gonna notice. But I think
⏹️ ▶️ John over time with normal phone usage, where you just pick it up, scroll through something and put it back down, it doesn’t really
⏹️ ▶️ John get a chance to get that hot until you put it on the dashboard of your car.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then I guess one more thing on the 15 before we leave it. I really do appreciate
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the titanium as a weight saving measure. I don’t think it needs necessarily be titanium
⏹️ ▶️ Marco specifically. It could be lots of other, it could be aluminum for all I care. Aluminum was fine
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for a long time and it is lighter than titanium even. So that would be fine
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as well. But I’m very glad they switched away from steel. I do know that apparently they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco switched to titanium and some of the structural change they made inside I think were actually part of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the problem with the thermals and I believe that they that’s part of why they had to revise them for the for the 16 line next
⏹️ ▶️ Marco week. But overall, it does feel very good in the hand. It
⏹️ ▶️ Marco feels great. And so I love the overall design of it, with the exception that I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the colors were garbage for the profile. Like I got the natural gray one, which I thought
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know last fall I was kind of in a gray mood and I thought this is Is it gonna be cool and different? And no, it’s just gray.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I know, I slightly disagree with you there. It is just gray, but I do think it’s a cool gray, like a neat
⏹️ ▶️ Casey gray, but I do mostly agree with you. If you’ll permit me to just carry on since I’ve
⏹️ ▶️ Casey already interrupted you.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it. With regard to the 15 Pro Max, I don’t hate
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the size. I don’t hate the size. And I do like having a little more real estate. It turns
⏹️ ▶️ Casey out that if you have a phone this big and your hands aren’t freakishly large, The pop socket is pretty much compulsory.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I have been thinking long and hard about what I will do if the Tetra Prism 5X lens
⏹️ ▶️ Casey comes to the Pro, but not Pro Max phone. So if the iPhone 16 Pro
⏹️ ▶️ Casey gets the 5X lens, sitting here now, I think I’m gonna go back to the smaller
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one, the human sized
⏹️ ▶️ John That’ll be the test actually, because right now you’re like, oh, the big phone, it’s annoying, but it’s nice to have more screen, it was that you’re really
⏹️ ▶️ John gonna find out how much you care about that screen when you go back to a smaller one. That’s
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey what you’re gonna
⏹️ ▶️ John If you don’t notice, it takes you a day, you’re like, fine, or whatever. But if you look at that screen and you’re like, I’m so used to seeing so
⏹️ ▶️ John much more stuff, or in this app, I could see a whole other column of whatever’s, that’s gonna really hurt you. So you may, we’ll
⏹️ ▶️ John see if you’ve irrevocably become one of the giant phone people, or whether you were just
⏹️ ▶️ John a tourist in their land.
⏹️ ▶️ John, Casey Right, and sitting here now,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think I was just a tourist, but I say that with little to no conviction. And the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey thing that frustrates me so about the big phone is that for my hands, for my body,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s really not a one-handed phone for anything more than swiping vertically. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey even still, if I’m using one hand, I must have the pop socket out. And I actually have come around on
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the pop socket. I don’t think it’s a bad thing at all. But I think in a perfect world, I would rather
⏹️ ▶️ Casey go back down to the standard size phone, presumably stop
⏹️ ▶️ Casey using a pop socket. I mean, we’ll see what happens. And being able to use my phone one-handed because
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it really is uncomfortable to use these giant phones one-handed. And, and I just really
⏹️ ▶️ Casey disliked that. I miss being able to use my phone one-handed. And I think what would happen is I would get the smaller
⏹️ ▶️ Casey phone, if this is the way I go, I’ll get the regular size phone and I’ll say, man,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I do miss that screen, but, oh boy, is it nice to be able to use my phone one-handed again?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And so I think ultimately that’s going to win the day, but we’ll see what happens. Now, now that I’ve
⏹️ ▶️ Casey shown that I can show myself, that is that I can handle a big phone. If there is some
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sort of big phone only feature that I feel interested in, like compelled by,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey then I’ll just stick with the big phone. Now, the current rumors are that I don’t think that’s going to be the case.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But if it is, I don’t think I would like begrudge for lack of a better word, you know, getting another big
⏹️ ▶️ Casey phone, but sitting here today, I don’t think that’s what I want to do. That being said, the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey 5x lens, I am very glad that I went for it and that I got it. There are definitely times
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that I want to be between two and five for sure. And I think Marco, you were not whining about this. That’s not
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the word I’m looking for either, but you were you were concerned about this before it came out. And I think it’s a valid
⏹️ ▶️ Casey concern. There are definitely times that I want an in between and in a perfect world, I would want, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey one or one half, one, two, three and five. And I know that’s nuts and that’s not going to happen, but
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that would be excellent. But I stand by getting the big phone for the 5X lens,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I really do feel like it gives me reach in scenarios that I wouldn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Casey have gotten nearly as good a shot otherwise. And I don’t want to give that up. So if for some reason
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the regular size phone doesn’t get the tetraprism lens, I will almost certainly stick with the big phone.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Having never had a big phone before, a lot of people would say that, oh, the battery life is infinite. Not unlike the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Apple Watch Ultra. You know, battery life is forever. It’s amazing. No, or at least
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not in my experience. I don’t feel like it’s demonstrably better than the regular size phones.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Maybe I’m using my phone more now, maybe I’m a banana, maybe
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m off my rocker, I don’t know. But I don’t feel like the battery life was night
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and day better, I really don’t. But I do think to echo what Marco said,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Marco said the USB-C, four thumbs up from me, the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey titanium two thumbs up. I do think that the natural titanium is a good
⏹️ ▶️ Casey color, but I concur that the rest of the colors stank and it looks like they’re only gonna get worse.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But yeah, I mean, all in all, I really do like these phones a lot. I really have enjoyed it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey The one thing I will say, and I will say again, and I’ve said this for the last several years, the front
⏹️ ▶️ Casey screen is too easily scratched. I scratched the snot
⏹️ ▶️ Casey out of this thing, I have no idea how. It’s so badly scratched that I am genuinely thinking I might
⏹️ ▶️ Casey become one of those lunatics that puts a screen protector on their phone because this thing is scratched to hell.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And I hate that, I hate it. And normally I would just go to Apple and use my AppleCare
⏹️ ▶️ Casey repair incident and I’ll probably try to do it to see if they’ll do it. But last time I tried this, they were like, oh, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey not damaged enough, tough nuts. And I’m just barely honest enough that I don’t just throw the thing on the ground
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in front of them and say, how about
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is definitely a weird incentive they’ve created.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m saying. I didn’t do that last year. I don’t plan on doing it this year. But it is
⏹️ ▶️ John Sounds like somebody might need a phone pouch.
⏹️ ▶️ John I hear you. How are you scratching your screen? How is this happening?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco How are you still using a phone pouch? What year is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, John this? I’m not. Yeah, that’s
⏹️ ▶️ John also fair. But Casey needs to be. I’m not using one. I have one scratch on my screen and it is very small. And I’ve had this phone
⏹️ ▶️ John for two years. I don’t know what you’re doing. Unless you’re going to have someone follow you around with a camera to find out what you’re
⏹️ ▶️ John doing because you stick your phone into your pocket full of sand, maybe you need a pouch.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I genuinely don’t know. And these are not small scratches. Like one of them is, well, semi-horizontally.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, John That’s what I’m
⏹️ ▶️ John saying. Are you putting it in your pocket with keys?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey No, I don’t, it’s gotta be me. I’m not saying it’s not my fault, but darned if I know
⏹️ ▶️ Casey what it was. And I’ve been rolling mostly caseless this year because I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey never really found a case I loved. I adored, what was it, the Peel case? I think we talked about
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this one, it was new. I adored the peel case, but they had a cutout for the action button, which I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey could not abide. And to the best of my knowledge, they never revised it. Like what was the one that they
⏹️ ▶️ Marco That was Peak Design. I actually, that’s the one I’ve been using the last few months.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, and I have nothing against Peak Design case. It’s just- Oh, it’s great, honestly. I really loved the peel case
⏹️ ▶️ Casey so very much, but I could not abide the lack of anything for the action button.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But I will say in the defense of the glass, and actually David Schaub in the chat reminded me of
⏹️ ▶️ Casey this. I have dropped this thing case free a handful of times, not dramatically,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but a handful of times in cases where I was in situations where I was like, Oh, here we go. Oh,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey well, at least I’ll get a new screen now. But, um, but I’ve, I’ve dropped it by accident a handful of times and it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey been no worse for wear, which I do appreciate, but golly, can I please have a less
⏹️ ▶️ Casey scratch prone screen. And I think,
⏹️ ▶️ John I think this trade off is the one Apple would say is the right one. It’s better to people because you’ve seen people
⏹️ ▶️ John use screens that are just destroyed. So people’s tolerance for using screens that are messed up is great.
⏹️ ▶️ John But shattering is over a lot of people’s limits. So the tradeoff is essentially you can make
⏹️ ▶️ John it more scratch proof, but then it’s going to be more prone to shattering. And so Apple, the balance Apple has chosen
⏹️ ▶️ John is it’s going to get a bunch of little hairline scratches all over it if you do whatever the hell Casey’s doing.
⏹️ ▶️ John But it will be more resistant to full blown shattering when you drop it. And despite
⏹️ ▶️ John the fact that that might annoy some of us who like if you’re very careful with your phone, a harder screen that was more scratch resistant
⏹️ ▶️ John would be better for you. But hell, I’ve dropped my phone plenty of times. It’s dropped off my nightstand onto a wooden
⏹️ ▶️ John floor plenty of times. I’ve dropped it off the dining room table onto a wooden floor. Like it hasn’t- Yeah, but you’re in a case,
⏹️ ▶️ John in a case, but you know, like you could still get unlucky with the way it falls in that situation. So I’ve dropped it enough times
⏹️ ▶️ John that I’m glad that it is as shatter resistant as it is.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I mean, I am glad it’s shatter resistant for sure, but, and I do think you’re right that this is a problem I can
⏹️ ▶️ Casey fix with a screen protector. And I think, the more I think about it and the more I talk about it, the more I think I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey am probably gonna, not have to, but choose to do that for the next one. So if you have a screen
⏹️ ▶️ Casey protector recommendation that you swear by, please reach out via Mastodon. Don’t email us, because it’s too much
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to email, please. But I would love to hear from, on Mastodon, or Threads for that matter, a screen protector
⏹️ ▶️ John And a clean room for Casey to apply it in. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John, Marco well, pretty much.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Some of them have gotten like really advanced now. Like, so like, when you order most like, you know, decent brand
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ones now, They come with basically little kits that you lay
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in this plastic cradle and you flip this thing right down exactly the right angle.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco They get really pretty complicated
⏹️ ▶️ John to try to do it right. They’re trying to help you as best they can because they know it’s a difficult thing to do, but if you’re doing it in
⏹️ ▶️ John a house full of cat dander or something, you’re kind of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’ve actually heard you’re often better off having either, sometimes the Apple Store will have people
⏹️ ▶️ Marco who are willing to do
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey it for you. if you buy it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there, but I don’t even know if they still sell screen protectors
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey there. But- I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey think Best Buy does it too or something
⏹️ ▶️ John This is a skilled labor thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, like even like mall kiosks that sell phone accessories will often do it for you for some small fee.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And usually, like I would actually suggest maybe trying that option because, yeah, like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as John said, like, you know, when you buy one and try to apply it, you’ve done, you’re doing this in your house
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with whatever conditions you can best approximate that are actually somewhat near maybe being ideal, but not quite
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ideal. And you’re gonna do what, two of these a year at most? You know, so like,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you’re not gonna have the, you know, the experience and the finesse of somebody who’s doing it like 10 times
⏹️ ▶️ John On the other hand, you will care much more than they will. If you’re the type of person who’s getting a screen protector because you can’t send even a single
⏹️ ▶️ John scratch on your screen, have fun dealing with that single speck of dust that did get under there.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I mean, you’re not wrong, but well, this is a problem for Casey in a week or two. It’s not a problem for Casey today.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But yeah, in grand scheme of things, I really enjoyed this phone and for no other
⏹️ ▶️ Casey reason I think I would be all in because of USB-C and everything else was just a bonus.
⏹️ ▶️ John You didn’t even mention the iPhone, plain iPhone 15 and I want to say that I think this year is one of the rare cases where
⏹️ ▶️ John Apple seems to have gotten caught with their pants down a little bit by the AI thing. They shipped a line
⏹️ ▶️ John of phones, the 15 and the 15 Pro, seemingly without realizing that that 15
⏹️ ▶️ John wouldn’t be able to run next year’s headlining feature. They’re going to ship, maybe they won’t
⏹️ ▶️ John ship it by then because they’re not shipping Apple Intelligence, but they could have ended up shipping Apple Intelligence that wouldn’t work on their
⏹️ ▶️ John latest non-pro phone if they had actually shipped Apple Intelligence before the new phones came out. Like,
⏹️ ▶️ John I think it’s unprecedented for a one-year-old phone not to be able to run the headlining
⏹️ ▶️ John feature of the next OS that came out after it a year later. And I just
⏹️ ▶️ John have to think it’s because they didn’t think that, oh, we can cheap out on the RAM on the 15, what’s the big deal? The iPhone’s got plenty of RAM, we’re
⏹️ ▶️ John well within the limits, blah, blah, blah, and here comes AI and LLMs using all your RAM.
⏹️ ▶️ John I will look back on this line, the 1550 Pro, and always remember it as the year where the non-pro
⏹️ ▶️ John phone had this crippling disability that was, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ John that could have been prevented with being a little bit more generous with RAM, but wasn’t, and it put Apple in this strange,
⏹️ ▶️ John somewhat uncomfortable position of having to tell people who just bought a brand new phone last year that, yeah, you can’t run Apple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think that speaks to just how far ahead iPhone components are planned.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And how recently, relatively speaking, Apple realized they had to get in on the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco LLM game. Because the iPhone 15 non-pro components were
⏹️ ▶️ Marco probably a lock, like what, two years ago maybe? We know they have pretty long
⏹️ ▶️ Marco timelines for a lot of that stuff. And so they probably started Apple Intelligence
⏹️ ▶️ Marco shortly after that was decided, or around the same time, maybe they didn’t know yet when they started
⏹️ ▶️ Marco doing LLM research and development. Maybe they didn’t realize like, we’re definitely gonna need
⏹️ ▶️ Marco X gigs of RAM to run this thing, you know. That was probably too early to know that. And a lot of Apple’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco efforts over the last year or two, like they’ve actually open sourced some things and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco published papers about compressing LLMs to fit in smaller
⏹️ ▶️ Marco amounts of RAM. They’ve done a lot of work in that area. Why? We’re seeing it now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco This is why they care so much about that.
⏹️ ▶️ John Yeah, I think they are barely fitting it in the 8GB phones. Like, it’s been a lot of hard work to get
⏹️ ▶️ John it to fit in the 8GB phones. And you can argue whether they were late to the game on LLM or because the lead time
⏹️ ▶️ John is so long, they just couldn’t help it. But this is another side effect of always being stingy with
⏹️ ▶️ John RAM. It’s the unforeseen thing, right? It’s like, we don’t need this. Why would we ever give ourselves any
⏹️ ▶️ John kind of buffer? Let’s cut it as close as we possibly can, save every penny because
⏹️ ▶️ John why would we give any excess RAM if we think the low end phone doesn’t need that? We want to provide a product
⏹️ ▶️ John differentiation. And the answer is you never know when something might come along
⏹️ ▶️ John that makes your stinginess hurt you more than your stinginess is currently helping you. Now Apple would probably argue,
⏹️ ▶️ John well, we’re stingy 90% of the time and we only lose out on it 10% of the time. So it’s still a win. But you know,
⏹️ ▶️ John I still think that being that stingy That’s the thing with RAM, like
⏹️ ▶️ John setting aside the AI thing, we’ve always said, when we talk about the Macs, settling in with too little RAM and having people upgrade
⏹️ ▶️ John or whatever, you wanna give your users a better experience. And in general, more RAM gives
⏹️ ▶️ John a better experience. There are so many things more RAM does for you, even on the 15 Pro. The fact that they
⏹️ ▶️ John had to work so hard to get Apple intelligence into eight gigs, that was their highest end phone.
⏹️ ▶️ John Even on that one, they could have still provided differentiation and given the Pro 10 and the non-Pro 8,
⏹️ ▶️ John instead of eight and six. Anyway, they seem to have snapped out of that with the 16s, which are rumored to all have the same amount of
⏹️ ▶️ John RAM, and the 17s are rumored to all have even more RAM, so we’ll see how this goes, but this is,
⏹️ ▶️ John you know, like I said, I’m gonna remember the 15, 15 Pro line with this one specific fact. Marco will remember
⏹️ ▶️ John it for USB-C, and I will remember it for the time that the non-Pro phone got left behind
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Well, and to be clear, it isn’t only about being cheap when they limit the amount of RAM in phones. That is certainly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco part of it, and that’s probably not a trivial part, But it’s also about battery life. RAM takes power.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like just having a certain amount of RAM, you have to be applying power to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that part of the chip, even if it’s not using that RAM for anything. Like even if it’s, you know, marked as free
⏹️ ▶️ Marco by the OS, you’re still powering that chip to a certain base level. That’s how DRAM works. So,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and forgive me for experts in the field, if I’m dramatically oversimplifying, or if there’s a whole bunch of asterisks on that now, there probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are. But in general, you don’t want to put a whole bunch of RAM into something that’s as battery constrained as a phone
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you’re not sure you’re gonna use it, because it does take battery.
⏹️ ▶️ John No, but it’s like, again, this is the pro line, you know? You can give them a little
⏹️ ▶️ John bit more, which allows you to give the non-pro line eight, which apparently is okay, you know? Because the pros got
⏹️ ▶️ John eight, and their battery life is okay with an even hungrier SoC, right? So the Plane 15 would also
⏹️ ▶️ John have been fine with eight. Like, you’re right, it does take more RAM, but we’re not asking for double. We’re not asking you to double the RAM. Just
⏹️ ▶️ John a little bit more, just give yourself a little bit of headroom. Just don’t be as stingy. You can still be stingy, but just
⏹️ ▶️ John not quite as stingy, because you never know when that’s gonna pay off.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco All right, so Apple Watch Series 9.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t have a lot to say about the Series 9, except that I have found
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the double tap gesture, which was one of its new headlining features, to be
⏹️ ▶️ Marco fairly bad. I don’t think it is fast enough or reliable
⏹️ ▶️ Marco enough to be useful. I have tried it over the last year many times.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco My hit rate with getting it to be recognized is low. And even when it is recognized, it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco takes a decent amount of extra time that you have to be still having the watch be like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco raised up and looking out so the screen stays on. And then it shows us a little animation to confirm
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that it understood your tap. And you could like, it just feels very slow. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have just mostly resorted to nose tapping the way I always have. if I have to be one-handed to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco dismiss something, because it is just faster and literally more reliable. Like it is more reliable for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco me to lift up the watch to my nose and tap it and hit the right spot on the screen than trying the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco double tap finger gesture. So I don’t know if that’s just me, but I have found generally
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the double tap is really not very useful.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I mean, I have a Series 8, and so this is going to be a very expensive September
⏹️ ▶️ Casey for us because we’re going watch and phone. We are on a two-year plan on watches and
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a one-year plan on phones. I feel like my complaints
⏹️ ▶️ Casey about the watch are the same as they ever were, which is to say
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the battery life is just straight up trash at this point.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Really? I don’t find that. I mean, mine’s a lot younger, obviously. It’s a year younger, but
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I find the battery life on the Series 9 is great, but I also didn’t have any problems with the Series 8.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, that’s the thing is I think a year worth Apple Watch battery is fine in my personal experience,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey two years, not so fine. And that’s been a real
⏹️ ▶️ Casey bugbear for me to the point that between Marcos friendly browbeating
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and also my friend in Richmond, Brad, just got a, like a month or two
⏹️ ▶️ Casey ago, got an Apple Watch Ultra 2 or whatever the current one is. And he will not
⏹️ ▶️ Casey shut up about how good the
⏹️ ▶️ Casey life is on this thing. And at this point, I think I am probably
⏹️ ▶️ Casey going to hold out until whenever the next ultra update is. And if that’s next week, perfect.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’d be preferred. But if not, I will try to hold out as long as I can. And if I can’t, I’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Casey probably just commit to the existing one, but it’s, it’s been so frustrating. And if I don’t top off my
⏹️ ▶️ Casey watch at some point during the day, it will typically die sometime after dinner. And I’m just
⏹️ ▶️ Casey sick of it. I’m just Now, also part of this is also influenced by the fact that I have the little watch.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I have the 40 millimeter, whatever the little
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco one is. Yeah, or 41, I think for you.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, I forget what it is now, or what it was in Series 8, but I’m just sick of it. I’m sick of always
⏹️ ▶️ Casey having to worry about my watch’s battery life. And so next time, it’s going to be an Ultra.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I’ll come back to that in a second. The only thing I wanted to say about the watch Series 9
⏹️ ▶️ Marco specifically is that they removed the option for titanium
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with the series 9 and I wish they didn’t and I hope for the series 10
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they bring back a titanium option for the non-ultra watch.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It was a bit like the titanium edition watch was not that much more money than a steel one.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It was really nice. It was lighter. I think it looked more refined. It had like a nice brushed finish. Like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it looked really nice. It felt really nice on the wrist. It was a way to have a little bit
⏹️ ▶️ Marco more subtle and a little bit lighter lighter watch than the steel without going down in quality
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on things like the crystal that you have to do when you get the aluminum one. The aluminum one looks like aluminum.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It looks fine, but it doesn’t look nice. The steel and the titanium both look very nice, and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco titanium I think was a little bit nicer of a look between the two, and again, I think it felt better. Also
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Apple watches tend to function better the lighter they are. The Taptic Engine is more feelable,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it moves on your wrist better, it sits on your wrist better. So I really hope they bring back titanium
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as an option on the Series 10 or whatever they’re going to call it, Series X, Series 10, whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Before you move on, and if you’d rather table this for later, we certainly can, but I would also be curious
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to hear what the status is of Adam’s Apple Watch. And I don’t remember what generation that is,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but we’ve been kicking around the idea of getting Declan one for an upcoming birthday. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’d be curious to hear what your, you know, year or two on review is of that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco The original one that we got him a few years back now was an SE, like the first gen watch
⏹️ ▶️ Marco SE. We replaced it a couple years back with I think a series 5
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or 6 that I’d gotten Amazon refurbished or renewed or whatever they call it for fairly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco cheap. He doesn’t wear it currently anymore because the school
⏹️ ▶️ Marco banned them. I guess kids have figured out like how to put notes in your Apple Watch to cheat on tests.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So, they banned them. So he hasn’t worn it in a long time. It’s been sitting in a drawer. It’s probably fairly
⏹️ ▶️ Marco dead now. But anyway, so I don’t, for now, he’s just not using a watch and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I don’t know when or if that will return, but we’ll find out. So about, so going
⏹️ ▶️ Marco back to, you know, kind of what I’m hoping for, for the Series 10. So number one,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco titanium option. And just for the record here, I’m not talking about software at all right now. I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco think the Apple Watch, like, you know, the watchOS 10 redesign changed a lot of things.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I still am not super sold on some of the watchOS 10 changes and placements and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco buttons and gestures and things like that. I’m still getting everything wrong all the time. I’m still pushing the wrong buttons or swiping the wrong
⏹️ ▶️ Marco edge to do things that I didn’t want to do. But maybe that’s just me. Of course I always
⏹️ ▶️ Marco have opinions on watch faces. But going back to just the hardware, I really hope again, titanium
⏹️ ▶️ Marco option on the non-Ultra series. Please bring that back. It was so nice.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m also always hoping for, I guess this is kind of software, sorry. I want display zoom
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on the Apple Watch. As you may know, my vision is slowly getting worse at close distances
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as I proceed through middle age. I use reading glasses for closeup reading of things sometimes.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m not always wearing my reading glasses because I’m not always reading. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have found as my vision has gotten slowly worse at that short arm distance,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco very small complications and very small text in complications, like say the timer
⏹️ ▶️ Marco complication which I use frequently, is getting a little hard to read. Now iPhones have
⏹️ ▶️ Marco many different accessibility technologies for font sizing and UI sizing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and different visual accommodations. The watch has almost none, which is surprising.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco There is dynamic type on the watch, which is the global text size setting, but it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco doesn’t affect that many things on the watch. They also on the phones have this thing called display
⏹️ ▶️ Marco zoom where that’s the mode where when you set up your phone, I don’t know if it still does this on all phones, but during
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that setup process it’ll ask you like, do you want things to be this size or this size?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And what it does is basically scale the entire screen up to simulate
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the field of view of like the next size smaller phone that existed or exists.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So, if you have a Pro Max and you pick that option, it’ll basically just
⏹️ ▶️ Marco blow up the screen dimensions of a Pro into the Pro Max screen. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you get everything scaled up perfectly, the same way you would do a resolution change on a monitor on a computer.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I want the watch to get that ability so that it can scale up everything, complications,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the faces, everything, when you have a larger model watch to simulate
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the screen size of a smaller model watch, blown up to its new size. I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco think that would be a great visual accommodation for people whose close-up vision is not that good
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whose vision in general is not that good. Because again, dynamic text on the watch is just not
⏹️ ▶️ Marco very well supported, doesn’t go very far, and doesn’t include almost anything on the watch face.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I would love to see that as an option. Again, that is a software thing, but maybe it’s requiring
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a certain GPU or whatever. And of course, the rumored larger screens that might be coming
⏹️ ▶️ Marco might make that easier to pull off and make it, you know, better of a feature.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Before we get to the screens, I’ll get there. But I’m hoping they found a way to keep the blood oxygen
⏹️ ▶️ Marco sensor. This is not a sensor I use frequently, but it’s nice to have it and we’ve had it and I think, you know,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco whatever they need to work out with Massimo, you know, to license that tech, that patent, I think they should just do
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, that is true. I am going to be really annoyed just in principle, if
⏹️ ▶️ Casey the hardware, at least for the, um, the blood oxygen sensor
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is not on whatever these new watches are, I’ll be lightly annoyed if it’s, if it remains disabled, which
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I expect it to, but I will be really annoyed if it’s incapable, you know, if this patent dispute ever gets
⏹️ ▶️ Casey fixed, if it’s incapable of doing any testing or measuring, that’s going to really chat my butt.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. And so I, again, just, it’s a minor feature. It’s not going to be the end of the world if I lose it, but
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I just don’t want to lose it like over Apple being, you know, BSE about patent licensing. And I understand,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco look, we all hate patents, but, and they tried so hard, but you know, you lost. Let’s move on.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Um, the only other thing I’ll get to for the hardware before we get to the screens is I really, really hope
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that the Apple Watch Series 10 supports Qi charging. Finally,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Qi 2 as a standard, I believe accommodates small enough devices that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I believe the Apple Watch could be charged via Qi 2 if the watch wanted
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to support it. So I’m hoping, because again, going back to our charging
⏹️ ▶️ Marco delights and paper cuts earlier with USB-C, I have now
⏹️ ▶️ Marco one cable and one port for everything except the Apple Watch. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco yeah, you can get combo chargers that have a special Apple Watch pad off to the side,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but you know what’s much more common? Batteries and chargers and stuff that just have a Qi pad and USB-C holes.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I would love to just have Qi support. me buy a battery from Anker
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whatever on Amazon that has a USB-C output and a standard Qi pad
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and then I can put whatever I want there. An AirPods case, a second phone, or an Apple Watch while
⏹️ ▶️ Marco traveling. That would be really nice. And again, I think Qi 2 has added what is necessary
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to make that work. So I’m hoping for that. Now about the screen sizes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco on the watch. There’s been all these rumors that the watch regular series
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is growing. That there’s going to be, you know, that basically the current
⏹️ ▶️ Marco small version, which I believe is 41mm or 42, that is going to go away and it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco going to basically, like, that both of them are going to be going up in size by a decent amount.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think this is going to be a good move overall. You know, we’ve said over time
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that Apple has done a really good job satisfying the market for smaller watches
⏹️ ▶️ Marco way better than most of the smart watch makers have ever achieved it. But
⏹️ ▶️ Marco watch fashion and the smart watch market have changed since the Apple Watch was introduced 10 years
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ago. And this happens, like in the watch world, the sizing of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco how big, like a standard, you know, and watches historically were very gendered. So there were like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco certain sizes, like, all right, men’s watches are going to be this size range for the most part, and women’s watches
⏹️ ▶️ Marco are gonna be this size range. Fortunately, in the era of smartwatches, first of all, a lot of the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco gendering has gone away to the point where now, like, you know, you don’t, if you buy the small
⏹️ ▶️ Marco watch, people don’t say that’s the women’s version. Like, it’s just a small watch. And the big one, women can wear it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and no one’s gonna say you’re wearing a man’s watch. Like, thank God we’ve gotten rid of all that, you know, BS.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Also, since the smartwatch era has really taken off over the last decade, demand
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for large watches has gone up. And which is funny, because in the regular watch world, like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the mechanical watch world, watches had gotten very big, then they kind of started going
⏹️ ▶️ Marco back a little bit. They’re actually getting a little bit smaller now, but smartwatches are going the other way.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Part of the reason so many people bought the Apple Watch Ultra is not because they were gonna be climbing a mountain and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco then diving into 200 meters of water. Like, it’s because they liked the bigger look.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And that’s for both functional reasons. Yes, it has better battery life, bigger screen. that’s great for smartwatches,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but also big watches are just in fashion right now. Really huge smartwatches are
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in style. And most people that I see are not wearing the smaller anymore.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I see a lot of people of a lot of different sizes and ages, and I don’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco see many people choosing that smaller Apple watch anymore. Meanwhile, if you look at the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco smartwatch market, the current quote big Series 9,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s the one I wear, and I think Casey probably should be wearing. The big one,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco relative to other smartwatches in the market, is actually fairly medium-sized. Many
⏹️ ▶️ Marco other smartwatches in the market are actually significantly bigger. What the Ultra’s success, I think, showed
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Apple and showed the market, is that yes, a lot of people choose it because of those technical factors,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but a lot of people also just like big watches. Big watches are in, especially
⏹️ ▶️ Marco smartwatch, big, big smartwatches. That is just in fashion right now. So if Apple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is truly getting rid of the smallest size and making them both bigger, I think that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not because they’re abandoning the market for small watches. I bet it’s more because the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco market abandoned theirs. The market probably moved on and has not been buying the small watch
⏹️ ▶️ Marco very much at all. And I think people of all wrist sizes have been choosing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco bigger smartwatches over the last few years, way more than they used to. So I think this is just Apple responding
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to the market and wanting to serve where the demand actually is. They did the same
⏹️ ▶️ Marco thing with phones and phone sizes growing over time. This is that they’re doing the same thing with the watch.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I think they’re gonna raise the sizes of both of them and everybody will complain about it
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for about a week and then we’ll try them and be like, oh, this is nicer, yep. And then
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’ll be fine. And people will buy them like crazy, especially the biggest one, way more than we think they will.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I think this is gonna be totally fine they increase the sizes of the watches a little bit.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco We’ll all get used to it and we’ll be fine.
#askatp: Old Overcast APIs
⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, let’s do at least a little bit of Ask ATP if we can. PG&E, Delenda Est. I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey love people who provide these kooky usernames and no real names. Anyways, Marco,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s not even Halloween for goodness sakes. Marco, how hard is it to maintain server compatibility with clients that are still going
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to be on the last iOS 16 or below builds of Overcast? Are you doing that thing, I’m sure there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a term for it, are you doing that thing where it’s like something along the lines of API.Overcast.fm
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you know, endpoints? Okay. ruin your answer then I’m sorry.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, well, so but well that is a good question, though, because like at some point I do end support for the really
⏹️ ▶️ Marco old API protocols. How hard it is to maintain server compatibility in general
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with old clients? If you, you know, just make us make a new copy of your API,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know, controller or functions or whatever, and just call this one like I’m currently on version six.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It’s really not that bad. The main problem comes when you have to do like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco significant changes to things like the server-side schema, like how your data
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is stored. I’m like so do you do you like build in compatibility layers? How long do you keep those over
⏹️ ▶️ Marco time? Do certain problems occur when older versions of the app sync that maybe like clobber changes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco from the new versions? Then do you accommodate that? Over time that complexity grows
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and how much you want to maintain it for a a decreasing number of clients, eventually that trade-off becomes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not worth it and you say, all right, you know what, in a month I’m gonna cut off support for iOS 12
⏹️ ▶️ Marco or whatever. The downside of doing that, of course, is Overcast is a server-dependent app.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And so if the servers stop supporting a certain client version, that version
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of the app does not work anymore. It will not get new updates. You cannot add new podcasts. You cannot download new podcasts.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco You can’t even log in. It will totally break that client. So I try not to do that until
⏹️ ▶️ Marco those clients are very old. In this case, the specifics of the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco new API for the rewrite, the protocol with which
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the clients speak to the server and vice versa has totally changed. It’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco way lighter on the servers, it’s way more efficient. The old protocol was very hard on the servers.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And so you would think I would have a pretty substantial incentive to end support soon
⏹️ ▶️ Marco for the old ones. but because the numbers drop off so fast for like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco how, like there’s not like in, in, you know, a month or two, there’s going to be a big
⏹️ ▶️ Marco chunk of those iOS 16 only people that fall off because they’ve, they replaced their phones. Even
⏹️ ▶️ Marco though the old protocol is way less efficient and way harder on the servers, I don’t have much incentive to
⏹️ ▶️ Marco end its support anytime soon because it’s, it’s going to be such a tiny percentage of the user base that’s going to be holding onto it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So that’ll probably be supported for a while. you know, we’re talking probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco years, multiple years, because again, there’s not much reason to end it yet. Eventually there will be, but
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the protocol is mostly what has changed, not the data storage layer.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And some of the things I’m doing, I’m trying over time to push more of the logic
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that was previously server-side logic, push more of it to the clients where possible,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in part just to lighten the load on the servers, and in part because sometimes that’s just way easier to do on the client,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I can offer better features if I do a client side. So for instance, the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco current test flight build, I have fixed a problem with the episode limit not
⏹️ ▶️ Marco being enforced. I’ve had this option forever of like, you can limit a podcast to only keep the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco latest, you know, one or two or five episodes of that podcast.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco This feature, if I was launching a new podcast app today, I would never offer this feature. It is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so tricky and problematic and that has been enforced server
⏹️ ▶️ Marco side to date. This new test flight build enforces a client side, and that’s part of why
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s fixed for a lot of people because doing it server side, because there’s all sorts of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco differences. I’ll get into a very brief diversion here. The problem is the way the servers,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco servers have to deal with data in very different ways. They have to deal with scale in very different ways. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco when you, as a user, when you subscribe to a podcast, to what you see,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco suppose you subscribe to a new podcast that has a thousand episodes back in its feed. You subscribe,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you now have in your app a thousand episodes that you don’t have any history with.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then a new one comes out, and maybe you play that one. Well, to your client,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that’s a thousand and one rows in a table, most of which have all zeros in them. And
⏹️ ▶️ Marco then, you know, you have, then that latest one, you can mark that as your progress or your plate or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco On the server, if I added a thousand rows to the table
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that keeps track of everyone’s status of episodes, every time someone subscribed to a podcast at
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a thousand episodes, it would take way more space and be way heavier and way more expensive to host.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And more servers, larger backups, everything, data size affects
⏹️ ▶️ Marco cost substantially. So that would be very bad. So on the server,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I do tricks like when you subscribe to a show, I assume
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that the state of everything that precedes your subscription in that in that feed is
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s deleted but not played like it’s just that’s the default state of everything that precedes your subscription
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to a new podcast. If you then go back and listen to one of the one that of course I insert that row,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but I have this these all these optimizations in place that like okay, I’m not going to add all thousand of those
⏹️ ▶️ Marco as new rows to this table because again that would blow up everything that logic wreaks havoc
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with episode limiting. And it’s been so tricky to get it right server-side. Couple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco years ago, I even let people opt into a beta of a new way to handle it,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco because I thought I finally had nailed it and taken care of all those cases and all the edges and all the weirdness
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that somehow would still be efficient and would still not store nearly as much as it had to. I tried
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so many different ways to do this and I never got it quite right. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with the new way that the new app talks to the servers, I’ve developed yet more
⏹️ ▶️ Marco issues with doing that server side. So what I’m gonna do is once this version
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of this app is reasonably out there, that does it all client side, because client side, it’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco way easier to do. The client has no, I don’t care if I take another five kilobytes on your phone.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So the client can have a thousand rows in the database when you subscribe to a feed because
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it’s just keeping it locally. It doesn’t, I don’t care, it’s a SQLite database, it’s super light. So the client
⏹️ ▶️ Marco can do perfect limiting because it has perfect information, whereas the server is simulating perfect information
⏹️ ▶️ Marco with a bunch of optimizations. So anyway, so what I plan to do is move that logic entirely
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to the client with the next release, and then over time, eventually tell the server to stop even trying
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to do that, to stop enforcing episode limits at all, because that will make a lot of things easier, it’ll reduce
⏹️ ▶️ Marco those bug potential in the app, and you don’t want the server trying to do it at the same time the app is doing it. So that’s kind
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of my long-term plan here, have the server stop enforcing that completely. When that happens,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if you are still, say, on an old client, if all of your overcast devices that you’re logged into,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco if none of them have the new version that does this, your episode limits will just slowly increase and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco things won’t get automatically deleted once they pass that limit. And so things
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like that kind of weird drift will start happening if you’re still using a very old version
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of the API. That’s another reason why eventually it does make sense to retire them because if they start producing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco weird conditions or things that could cause bugs for other clients, you’ve got
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to retire them then or find a way to limit them. But for the most part,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco because I’m moving more towards more stuff happening on the client and the server side
⏹️ ▶️ Marco feature set is fairly fixed, I don’t intend to really do much more server side unless
⏹️ ▶️ Marco we get into things like transcriptions, but that’s a whole other bag
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Because of all that, I expect the iOS 16 API to still work for a long time,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to answer your question in a very long way.
#askatp: Does following “help the show”?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Mark Robinson writes, when a podcast says, follow us on Apple podcasts, it really helps the show. Does listening through overcasts
⏹️ ▶️ Casey do that as well? Does Apple register that follow in a way that counts and helps the show? Also, how does
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it actually help the show?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Listening through overcast doesn’t do anything to affect Apple podcasts or its rankings. Because Apple podcast does
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not know that you’re listening in overcast. If you subscribe to a podcast in Apple podcasts,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Apple does register that in some way, and it does help the show.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It helps the show mainly in ranking it higher and possibly helping it get on certain
⏹️ ▶️ Marco top lists or ranked lists that are occasionally used for discovery in Apple Podcasts.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Over time, I think they’re using this less in the sense that they’re doing more kind of
⏹️ ▶️ Marco things you might like type of recommendations rather than top list of new and noteworthy
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this week or whatever. So I think this is mattering less over time. But they basically,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco they historically have used new follows as a strong
⏹️ ▶️ Marco signal, but I think possibly at some times I think that was actually the only signal that would feed into what
⏹️ ▶️ Marco shows up on their top hot list today. It is a pretty good signal overall,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like how many new follows a show getting. And for the record, I actually try not
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to have those kind of metrics in Overcast that or global like that because
⏹️ ▶️ Marco it tends to reinforce like the rich get richer. So I’ve kind of, I’ve
⏹️ ▶️ Marco moved away from most of those over time. But that is, as far as
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I know, that is still part of how Apple Podcasts does recommendations and rankings. All right,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco thank you to our sponsor this week, Squarespace. Thanks to our members who support us directly. You can join
⏹️ ▶️ Marco us at atv.fm slash join. One of the member perks is ATP overtime, a bonus
⏹️ ▶️ Marco topic every week just for members. This week’s Overtime, we’re talking about
⏹️ ▶️ Marco AI angst. There are some tricky things going on with the AI world, including
⏹️ ▶️ Marco authors suing Anthropic and some drama over at NaNoWriMo. We’re going to be talking about both
⏹️ ▶️ Marco those things in ATP Overtime. You can join to listen at ATP.fm slash join. Thanks, everybody.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m gonna talk to you next week.
Ending theme
⏹️ ▶️ John Now the show is over, they didn’t even mean to begin
⏹️ ▶️ Casey accidental, oh it was accidental
⏹️ ▶️ John John didn’t do any research, Margo and Casey wouldn’t let
⏹️ ▶️ Marco him Cause it was accidental, oh it was
⏹️ ▶️ John accidental And you can find the show notes at atp.fm
⏹️ ▶️ John And if you’re into Mastodon, you can follow them at
⏹️ ▶️ Marco C-A-S-E-Y-L-I-S-S So that’s K-C-L-I-S-M-A-R-C-O-A-R-M-N-T
⏹️ ▶️ John S-I-R-A-C-U-S-A Syracuse It’s
⏹️ ▶️ John accidental, they didn’t mean to
⏹️ ▶️ John Accidental, check podcast
Neutral: Rivian woes
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m not having a good time in neutral land right now. Uh oh.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Battery fault. Yes, so, remember when that battery fault message
⏹️ ▶️ Marco popped up about a month ago?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Oh, I do, and I can’t believe you haven’t gotten the car serviced yet.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And I said at the time, I’ll get it serviced as soon as I’m back off the beach for
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the school year. It’s going to be a pain in the butt, and driving all the way to Brooklyn for the Rivian Service Center.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I’m gonna send you two photos in sequence here into the Slack group and I’ll
⏹️ ▶️ Marco try to put them as chapter
⏹️ ▶️ John have to say that this whole deal, like with EVs, we don’t have an established culture
⏹️ ▶️ John the way we do with internal combustion engine cars about
⏹️ ▶️ John the various levels of severity of things that can happen. And I know the culture is not consistent. You’ll know people who drive their
⏹️ ▶️ John car with a check engine light on forever and ever. But most people who know something about cars, If the check
⏹️ ▶️ John engine light comes on, it’s a sign that you should do something. Not like, I’ll do it in a few, I’ll look at
⏹️ ▶️ John it in a few months, it’s probably fine. Maybe it’s fine, or maybe your engine’s about to blow up. Whereas with EVs,
⏹️ ▶️ John they all have their own error messages, their own things, and there’s no sort of universal equivalent of a
⏹️ ▶️ John light on the dashboard that we know, these ones are serious, oil pressure drops to zero, stop
⏹️ ▶️ John the car, you know what I mean? Things that we know about internal combustion. With EVs, it’s like, I don’t know, is
⏹️ ▶️ John that bad? Is a battery fault bad?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Right, and especially a battery fault that only shows up when doing DC fast charging on a highway, and then I reboot the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco car a couple of times and it doesn’t show up anymore. Like, okay, I
⏹️ ▶️ John guess it’s fixed. Right, like you don’t have any frame of reference for how seriously should I take this?
⏹️ ▶️ John Since I last reported on that,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I have developed a few additional problems. Oh no. So I mentioned
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the dramatically increased wind noise since getting the body shop to replace the side, which
⏹️ ▶️ Marco admittedly that’s probably the body shop’s fault, but there was wind noise before they did their work also, there was just a little bit less of it.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But so, you know, wind noise, I gotta get them to fix that. I had an increasing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco incidence of what seems like the auto steer system crashing.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco No, not literally, thank God, but I guess poor choice of words. But the auto
⏹️ ▶️ Marco steer sometimes will just turn off and make a bunch of noise, and it’ll say, highway assist
⏹️ ▶️ Marco system failure. And so that sounds like it crashed to me,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco but or some sensor broke. So I have to have them look at that. Also,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I can no longer move the seat of the car. The driver’s seat does
⏹️ ▶️ Marco not move unless I am switching between the two profiles, the Tick profile and the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Me profile. Hope you’re happy with the profiles. Yeah, it will not move. Like none of the adjustments work.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco It is just stuck. Like it refuses any other adjustment besides the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco profile switches. So if I wanted to like, you know, let me put it up a little bit. Nope, can’t do that. If anybody
⏹️ ▶️ Marco else needs to drive my car, too bad. If I need to move the seat back to like to get something out from under it, nope, too bad.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Which to me, that might, that’s actually probably like a safety issue that I should probably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco get fixed pretty immediately. And finally,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I barely have air conditioning. The air conditioning
⏹️ ▶️ Marco almost completely gone out. It blows very weak air and goes through lots of times
⏹️ ▶️ Marco when it, the fan will just like kind of slow down and it’ll blow totally hot air
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and then it’ll go back eventually and blow slightly cold air but it’s bad
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like today was only in the high 70s and it couldn’t keep up like it was not
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a hot day and it could not keep up and it was blowing warm air most of the time
⏹️ ▶️ Marco so the air conditioning i basically have no air conditioning or i have almost no air air conditioning. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I created a support ticket in there and you know the way you get service from Rivian is you
⏹️ ▶️ Marco go to their app and you like report your problems you can attach photos and whatever else. So I created the support ticket with all these
⏹️ ▶️ Marco issues. I do find it very funny that apparently
⏹️ ▶️ Marco when you add five issues to a ticket it says at the bottom you’ve reached the max number
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey Please submit
⏹️ ▶️ Marco these and start a new request. So my car says otherwise. right?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I’ve reached the maximum number of problems with my Rivian that I can put in one on one service request.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So I thought okay well you know maybe I maybe I get in the service center within the next couple of weeks you know
⏹️ ▶️ Marco get get this done. I have I’m a little scared because I have heard that
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this level 3 charging battery problem I’ve found a couple of forum threads people said it took them like months
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to figure it out so I’m not loving that but we haven’t gotten there and we’ll see what happens.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So okay maybe I can get in the service Center, again, in maybe a week or two. Then we go to the
⏹️ ▶️ Marco next screen, which I’ll send you now. These were the first available appointments.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Oh, no. Oh, that’s not good at all.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco The first available Rivian appointment in my entire region of New York
⏹️ ▶️ Marco is 10 weeks from now, November 13.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey That’s undesirable.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yes. So, and I checked, like there’s a couple other like Rivian
⏹️ ▶️ Marco service centers that are like, you know, a hundred miles away and it’s no better. It’s the same.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like they’re all out to November.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey You should check Richmond. I bet there’s not a lot here.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I am not happy right now. Like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m starting to fall out of love with owning a first version car
⏹️ ▶️ Marco rapidly. And I knew when I bought it, I’m like, this is the first version of the R1S.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Maybe I’ll have some problems. I don’t think I fully appreciated how much this sucks.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco That I now feel like my car is unreliable in some pretty key areas
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and is losing things like air conditioning. Like I’m pretty sure we solved that problem a long time
⏹️ ▶️ Marco ago. But no, air conditioning also broken as well as the seat being
⏹️ ▶️ Marco too smart to move. I am really tired of beta testing cars. Whatever my next
⏹️ ▶️ Marco car is, I think it’s, first of all, I think it might be sooner than I expect but second
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of all, I think I just want to get something from a regular car company again, like an established car
⏹️ ▶️ Marco company. I’m tired of the flux and I think
⏹️ ▶️ Marco even though I love the features of this car in a lot of other ways,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco this rapidly erases those gains in my head. to deal with service, especially
⏹️ ▶️ Marco dealing with bad service, like what this is turning out to be. To make a good car ownership experience.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, the car needs to be good. It also needs to have almost no problems during ownership, especially
⏹️ ▶️ Marco when they’re new. They really, at least this car is a year old. It should not be having any of these problems, let alone all of these problems
⏹️ ▶️ Marco after one year, a car mostly shouldn’t have problems in its first few years. Besides the basics
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of like, you know, maintain the very basics of the car, like the brakes and the windshield wipers and stuff like that and the tires
⏹️ ▶️ Marco you know that that should be all you have to do for a car in the first couple of years um and so you shouldn’t
⏹️ ▶️ Marco have these problems at all but if you do have problems you need the service and servicing infrastructure to be there and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco to be near you like this is already you know having to drive to brooklyn like it’s driving to the service
⏹️ ▶️ Marco center will take me an hour and a half on a good day like and
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and i’m in like the worst part of brooklyn where there’s nothing around it’s all warehouses and it’s terrible
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and And God knows how many times I’m going to have to do that, too. So it’s already a rough service
⏹️ ▶️ Marco situation. And to have service then be backed all the way out ten
⏹️ ▶️ Marco weeks when you ask for it, that’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco … I’m going back to a regular car company. I can’t … But what would
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you buy? No argument. And I am disappointed by this just peripherally because you
⏹️ ▶️ Casey were so in love with that car when you first got it. Yes. As much as I will always
⏹️ ▶️ Casey and forever make fun of the god-awful color choice you made, like it was, is a great car.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But I don’t think you have a lot of really good options, especially for a battery
⏹️ ▶️ Casey electric vehicle. Now, if you wanted to go back to like a Range Rover or Land Cruiser or whatever the hell it was you had before, then
⏹️ ▶️ Casey maybe. But if you’re trying to go battery electric, what could you possibly get? I
⏹️ ▶️ John was going to say, when the Land Rover is the more reliable option, you know you’re in trouble.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, for real. I think I’d be looking probably at like probably BMW again or
⏹️ ▶️ Marco maybe even Polestar, but that’s also a little bit too new. I think I would have the same problems with Polestar.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey What of these cars? Like, I don’t think there’s anything battery electric that either of these companies sell
⏹️ ▶️ Casey that would work for the beach, right?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m going to shortly stop needing that because I’m going to shortly stop qualifying for my permit and
⏹️ ▶️ John It is. You go back to getting regular cars then.
⏹️ ▶️ John have to get these stupid SUVs anymore.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco That’s right. Right. So I that’s why I like I might be in the market, you know, maybe in six
⏹️ ▶️ Marco months or something, I might be in the market for something that is smaller
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and or at least like, you know, one of the options I’m looking at the BMW ix, which I think is actually a very attractive
⏹️ ▶️ Marco option. Not it’s not not an attractive vehicle, but it is. It’s a very attractive option.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Looking at that, looking at, you know, there’s, you know, Hyundai stuff, there’s Volvo stuff, there’s
⏹️ ▶️ Marco there’s a bunch of things. Many of them have of the first year problem, or like the first couple
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of years problem. And again, I just, I think I’d be looking at maybe something a little more established.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco The really sad thing is, I really would not, I don’t think, buy a Tesla right now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Like for lots of political reasons, that just feels very bad to me. But I see why people do,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco because when you look at the numbers of just like, how much range does it offer?
⏹️ ▶️ Marco And then what are you paying to get that car? Tesla is still way ahead
⏹️ ▶️ Marco of everybody. Like their cars get such longer range than almost everyone
⏹️ ▶️ John They claim longer range, but they’re also one of the most distant from their claims.
⏹️ ▶️ John So if you’re just looking at this thing.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But I had Teslas. Yeah, they’re a little BSE. I
⏹️ ▶️ John know, but there are cars out there now that are claiming less than Tesla that just get the same range, right?
⏹️ ▶️ John So you can’t go by the numbers that are on the package.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Sure. But yeah, I think I’m gonna like… Well, let me see… I mean, let
⏹️ ▶️ Marco me see what happens with the Rivian. But like, I… I feel like I can’t depend on it. I’m
⏹️ ▶️ Marco gonna take a long trip soon, and I feel like can I depend on it to get there? I’m gonna get there without
⏹️ ▶️ Marco air conditioning. But, you know, which is already a problem. And I probably can’t have
⏹️ ▶️ Marco any other place service it, because it’s probably all special and proprietary. So, can anybody else replace
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the air conditioning? Whatever. Probably not. I don’t know. This is why
⏹️ ▶️ Marco I’m falling off the Rivian train really fast right now, because I’m having all these problems pile up over
⏹️ ▶️ Marco the last couple of months that are now going to be difficult to get fixed. That’s not
⏹️ ▶️ John You’ve got to wait to get all this fixed before you can even trade in or resell this thing probably too.
⏹️ ▶️ John on what I’m doing. Let the buyer listen to this podcast.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, right. I wouldn’t do a private sale. I would I would do like, you know, a dealer thing or something.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco But yeah, I don’t know. Anyway, so there might be some turbulence there in the next few months. We’ll see.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Hopefully, I can last longer than that.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m really sorry to hear that. And what you said a moment ago, that you’re not sure if it can reliably get
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you to your destination.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco because it almost didn’t. I was almost stranded on the last trip I took.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, no argument. The moment any of my cars have gotten to that point where it’s no longer an inconvenience,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but a genuine concern that you might not make it.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey The moment that happens, I’m out. I need a new car in, or even if it’s a new used car, that’s fine.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey But I need something different because I cannot, well, maybe cannot as a bit dramatic,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but I, I refuse to be in a situation that if I need to get somewhere in my car,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I am rolling the dice more than, you know, you always are as to whether or not I’ll actually
⏹️ ▶️ Casey get there. And at that point I’m out. So if you’re me, you’re already looking for something new. And
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it doesn’t even matter if you can get this into a service center before November, it’s, it’s already, it, the nails
⏹️ ▶️ Casey in the coffin. You’re done.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Honestly. I mean, unfortunately, like if that happens, I got the early pre-order pricing on it. So
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like, I actually, like I looked up, like, you know, roughly what the resale value of it would be, and like, I would not be losing
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that much at all from what I paid a year ago. So it actually would not be that bad, but honestly, I’m thinking
⏹️ ▶️ Marco that direction because like, so in three days, I’m driving
⏹️ ▶️ Marco a few hundred miles upstate. I can’t really take Tiff’s I3 conveniently, also she
⏹️ ▶️ Marco needs it, like she’s not coming. I’m driving to go see Goose in concert, so there’s no way Tiff’s going to that.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco So anyway, so I’m driving a few hundred miles in three days
⏹️ ▶️ Marco and I need my car to work, and that’s like, to already know that, okay, I’m not gonna have any air conditioning
⏹️ ▶️ Marco probably on the trip, that sucks enough, But to not even know, when I have to plug
⏹️ ▶️ Marco in somewhere, is it gonna charge? Maybe. Is something else gonna go wrong with it? Maybe. I
⏹️ ▶️ Marco don’t know. I’m feeling very bad about this right now.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, you know, honestly, if it were me, there is no question I would be
⏹️ ▶️ Casey going and renting a car. And I know it’s like- And I thought about that, I might do that. I know it turns your
⏹️ ▶️ Casey stomach to think about, well, probably renting a car, but I know it turns your stomach to consider a gasoline
⏹️ ▶️ Casey automobile, But it is OK to slum it with us regular humans for the purpose
⏹️ ▶️ Casey of one weekend. That’s 100% what I would do. Yeah,
⏹️ ▶️ John one of the latest Honda hybrids, I think you might enjoy those, because Honda
⏹️ ▶️ John finally switched to the system where basically the gasoline engine is charging the battery, and the battery is running
⏹️ ▶️ John the electric motor that turns the wheels most of the time. And that will be a more
⏹️ ▶️ John familiar experience to you. Oh, it feels like a not very fast EV most of the time with some additional noise
⏹️ ▶️ John that I don’t understand. You might like it. Why would I want that? Because it’ll be reliable and
⏹️ ▶️ John it’ll get you there. And it’ll get better mileage than a plain old gas car. You have 50
⏹️ ▶️ John miles per gallon in a Honda that you can get fixed anywhere that will get you to your destination no matter what.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I don’t think you need to buy anything, but I do think you need to rent something for this trip to go see goose.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco That’s honestly, I, I was, I’m thinking about renting something, but like to rent a car for it’s, you know, I’m going to be gone for like
⏹️ ▶️ Marco three, four days. It’s that’s like, you know, $600. I mean, like it’s, it’s not a small amount
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s not that bad at all. We
⏹️ ▶️ Casey, Marco rented a minivan.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Well, okay. That’s fair. We rented a minivan for a week and I think it was like three or 400
⏹️ ▶️ Casey bucks. And that was a week and it was unlimited miles, et cetera, et cetera. Now, granted we are in Podunk, Richmond,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Virginia. We are not in effectively New York city, but I think it’d be more affordable than you expect if you’re willing
⏹️ ▶️ Casey to slum it with a regular human car rather than some like Tesla or some
⏹️ ▶️ Casey other weirdo BEV or something like that. Yeah. I don’t know. I mean, you do, obviously you do you, you’re, you’re
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a grown, you’re a grown-ass man, but that’s what I would
⏹️ ▶️ Marco do. I think like, you know, I certainly feel like a fool. I felt like a fool, like, you know, driving around a dented
⏹️ ▶️ Marco truck for, you know, a few months or whatever or weeks, whatever it was. I would feel extra foolish
⏹️ ▶️ Marco renting a car because I can’t trust mine to drive a few hundred miles reliably.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey No, I wouldn’t feel foolish about that. Personally, I get what you’re saying. And I think foolish
⏹️ ▶️ Casey is not the word I would use. I would feel dejected that it’s gotten to this point, but I wouldn’t feel foolish
⏹️ ▶️ Casey at all. But you’re doing, you’re doing what you can to make what is, what should be an enjoyable weekend enjoyable.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey And I love you like a brother. Well, no, in a better way than that. I love you,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey but I don’t think it’s a far stretch for you to throw money to fix it, to throw money at
⏹️ ▶️ Casey a problem to fix it. So I think this is right in your wheelhouse. This is what I would do.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah. But what’s then like when I have to drive to Thanksgiving in, you know, about 11 weeks,
⏹️ ▶️ Marco like that’s future Marcos problem. And then Christmas after that, and like, I need
⏹️ ▶️ Marco my car to work. I need like, I can’t. I’m so, I’m like, I’m unreasonably
⏹️ ▶️ Marco angry at this Rivian experience right now.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey No, this is what I’m saying. I think
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I’m not doing you favors because I’m wholeheartedly in agreement with you. It’s time to sell the car. Like, unless
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you can get it fixed by some miracle in the next week or two, and you don’t have a series of further problems,
⏹️ ▶️ Casey it’s time to sell the car. Full stop. And I hate that, I hate that that’s the case because I
⏹️ ▶️ Casey was there with you. I saw with my eyes how happy that car made
⏹️ ▶️ Casey you. Even after I broke it for the first of what turned out to be many times. I saw
⏹️ ▶️ Casey how happy that car made you. It does not give me pleasure to say this to you. This is not the normal like ATP ribbing.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Like I genuinely think as your friend, you need to sell that car because it is forever
⏹️ ▶️ Casey tainted. It has its scarlet letter. It is forever tainted in your mind. And I don’t blame you. I don’t blame
⏹️ ▶️ John you at all. good version 2 of that car where they consolidated the 17 control units down to 2 or whatever.
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Yeah, that’s true too. It’s an option.
⏹️ ▶️ Marco Yeah, but the colors are so much worse in
⏹️ ▶️ Marco, Casey the version 2. Oh, here we go. Are they really worse?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey Now I’m coming back to ATP ribbing. Are they really worse, Marco? Are they really?
⏹️ ▶️ Casey All right, well, I’m sorry. Please keep us updated with how this turns out, both in a friendly way and because
⏹️ ▶️ Casey I think it’ll be good for the show way.
⏹️ ▶️ John that’s the main reason you should try to take the Rivian because whatever happens, It’ll be a good story.